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WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-06-2005 17:42

If you are a US citizen I would urge you to following this link and see what is happening with the Real ID act.
https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy?page=UserAction&cmd=display&id=119

You can get more information from CNET on this:
http://news.com.com/FAQ+How+Real+ID+will+affect+you/2100-1028_3-5697111.html

I can tell you that you do not want to have this kind of technology linked to yourself. This is not only an ID, but there is the potential that it will require that you have your fingerprint imprinted on this ID, and that an RFID chip embedded. This means that you can be tracked everywhere and anywhere. And all of your personal information is going to be shared, in a national database.

This does not offer security, this is a means of control. I urge you to go to the EFF and take action. They make it very simple. Let you senator know that you do not approve of technology that allows the government further control over its citizens.

America is a country of freedom. We should not be a police state. Please look into this. Do not underestimate this. This one seemingly innocuous act might change the way that Americans are forced to accept life. I do not want to live in a country where my children will grow up knowing that they are being constantly monitored by their government. Again please take the time and look into this, and to speak up and out about it.

Dan @ Code Town

reisio
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Florida
Insane since: Mar 2005

posted posted 05-06-2005 19:29

Good old republicans.

WebShaman
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 05-06-2005 21:44

JESUS fucking christ!!

I leave the States for a few years, and Mr. Bush goes and fucks everything to hell and back!

What the hell did I fight a war for?

What the fuck did our forefathers fight wars for?

And what do Americans go and do to themselves?

quote:
Why did these ID requirements get attached to an "emergency" military spending bill?
Because it's difficult for politicians to vote against money that will go to the troops in Iraq and tsunami relief. The funds cover ammunition, weapons, tracked combat vehicles, aircraft, troop housing, death benefits, and so on.



Speechless.

Heh.

It is so moronic, and ironic, that it is funny.

Excuse me, I think I'm going to go laugh hysterically in the corner of my cell for the next 4 years.

Gilbert Nolander
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: Washington DC
Insane since: May 2002

posted posted 05-06-2005 21:53

This to me, is the problem with everyone in this country (America) bitching and moaning about the stupidest littlest things. Major issues like this get generally overlooked by the majority of people in this country because they are to worried about whether or not someone should be able to drive without a seatbelt, talk in a car with a cell phone, or smoke where ever they want to.

Or, ahhh..something.

Tired.

----| Asylum Quotes

WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-06-2005 22:04

I must say I am a little happier right now. I went home for lunch and read the paper, and found my senator berating the bill because of them trying to skirt this through. I am going to chalk this one up to the fact that I sent her emails and called her office on this. She said it was sickening that they would attach this ID Bill to a bill that also supports the troops. I am ashamed, but I am glad that at least one of my senators is paying attention.

If you are ashamed of this legislation like I am, make sure to contact your senator. Make them have a big debate on this. Let them know you do not want it. It really only takes half an hour to voice you opinion. The EFF makes it easy to send an email and it is not hard to get your senators phone number.

http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

If you don't agree with this please please do not let this one slide by you. This is the time to act. Do not complain after it is done, act now, let your senator know that you will support him/her if they stop this bill, and then let them know that if they support this bill they will be losing your vote.

Dan @ Code Town

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-06-2005 22:54

I've been writing my Reps/Senators on this one for a couple months now, not that it does any good, but hey, one must try. Glad to see others are catching on over this one. Probably too little too late though unfortunately. The ball is in play, and since when do they listen to the people's wishes? The mainstream media creates the perceptions of people and thus far the mainstream media has been fucking useless. They could have made people aware of this thing months ago, but it is not until recently that it has hit the mainstream.

That coupled with the fact that over the past 30 years this nation has successfully been dumbed down into a bunch of idiots being lead around by a goddam leash, the majority of whom couldn't even tell you who their representatives are, let alone think independently of the media telling us how good this is and write them. They don't even understand the concept of freedom anymore because it is a word long hijacked by political rhetoric, very orwellian-esque.

The good thing is, if idiots like me can wake up, anyone can, so get to it.

quote:
Good old republicans.



You might be interested to know this is a largely bipartisan effort. Not to defend the Republicrats, but the Demoblicans are just as bad. They are all playing the same game and the sooner you all realize that the better.

Otherwise, say goodbye to 10th Amendment's states rights, privacy, among other things. I think most Americans are just going to wake up one day and realize there is a shackle around their leg and a piece of duct tape over their mouth. Meanwhile, the border is wide open, ports are wide open, etc. Who is this war on again?

For anyone interested, (if you are a citizen it is your duty) go here and look up HR 418, quite a nice piece of legislativce crap. You can also look up congressional record, sponsors, and voting records to see who is supporting it. Once you have educated yourself on the matter go and write all your Senators and Reps, let them know your unhappiness. Call them, write them, whatever.

quote:
Excuse me, I think I'm going to go laugh hysterically in the corner of my cell for the next 4 years.



Do you think this is Bush's doing? Do you think this is going to stop if someone else gets in office from one of the two major parties? We are far too gone from that. Clinton set the groundwork for all this crap, Bush is implementing the plan. They're on the same team.

Also, Britain and Canada have similar legislation coming up. It's all part of the control grid.

The Real ID act also sets up a tri-country database with Mexico and Canada. Can anyone say Pan-American Union?

Papers please.

quote:
What's going to be stored on this ID card?
At a minimum: name, birth date, sex, ID number, a digital photograph, address, and a "common machine-readable technology" that Homeland Security will decide on. The card must also sport "physical security features designed to prevent tampering, counterfeiting, or duplication of the document for fraudulent purposes."

Homeland Security is permitted to add additional requirements--such as a fingerprint or retinal scan--on top of those. We won't know for a while what these additional requirements will be.



Fucking bastards.

Anyone for gun legislation might want to reconsider their position, we may need them soon enough if the police state trend continues.

Ramasax

(Edited by Ramasax on 05-06-2005 23:24)

WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-06-2005 23:01

I have been having thoughts that way too. On the gun legislation end.

We are either going to have a revolution, or I am going to end up being put in jail or shot for my discenting beliefs.

I believe that each time I write something like this I am putting another nail in my coffin. I am honestly very scared.

Dan @ Code Town

reisio
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Florida
Insane since: Mar 2005

posted posted 05-06-2005 23:23
quote:
WebShaman said:

What the hell did I fight a war for?


...are you implying that a war in the USA's recent history was about freedom?

(Edited by reisio on 05-06-2005 23:35)

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-06-2005 23:36

Removing post for loss of context.

(Edited by Ramasax on 05-06-2005 23:37)

(Edited by Ramasax on 05-06-2005 23:45)

WebShaman
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 05-07-2005 00:10

reisio,

I fought in the First Gulf War.

Irregardless of what one thinks of it, yes, it was about freeing Kuwait from Iraqi forces, among other things.

A few good friends of mine died there.

[edited due to...fuck it, it doesn't matter why. Just edited]

(Edited by WebShaman on 05-07-2005 00:12)

NoJive
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: The Land of one Headlight on.
Insane since: May 2001

posted posted 05-07-2005 06:41

Just saw an interview with former republican senator Barr. He is not a supporter. Lots of other good info here too.

http://www.pbs.org/now/

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-07-2005 07:42

Good link NoJive, thanks.

Here is a good article written by Rep. Ron Paul with regard to the RealID Act: The National ID Trojan Horse

Here are some other recent privacy and rights related issues I have been following in just the past week for anyone interested. Lot's of things happening.

Check this video out, unreal: Protesters Subject To Police Choking, Pain Compliance



Oh, and here in Pittsburgh tomorrow we are having one of those terrorism drills. Yay!
Volunteers Needed for Terror Drill at PNC Park

I should go down and shot some footage, but I would probably get arrested and have my stuff confiscated.

Ramasax

(Edited by Ramasax on 05-07-2005 07:44)

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-11-2005 01:26

Update: The senate just passed the Real ID act (HR 418), grafted into the supplemental spending for Iraq and Afghanistan (HR 1268), 100-0.

*sigh*

Ramasax

warjournal
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From:
Insane since: Aug 2000

posted posted 05-11-2005 03:26

To quote John Spartan: "Why don't you shove a leash up my ass while you're at it?"

Thumper
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Deeetroit, MI. USA
Insane since: Mar 2002

posted posted 05-11-2005 08:07

Didn't George Orwell write a book about this?

I seem to remember a post about this and how WalMart expected to use similar technology to [supposedly] help them keep track of inventory in their warehouses. But the real argument was in how they plan to use RFID technology to target your buying habits and use it in marketing systems (since they intend to implant the chips into their products). Essentially, the topic has been around for quite a long time. It's scary to say the least.

http://www.ozoneasylum.com/6624

http://www.ozoneasylum.com/22193

(Edited by Thumper on 05-11-2005 08:19)

WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-11-2005 15:58

When there is even a marginal portion of your society that is against something like this, you would think that there would be a debate on it. I don't think you can/shoul have a unanimous decision on anything like this.

100-0 is just a ridiculous amount of support considering the outcry against this. If this doesn't show corruption of the system, then I do not know what does.

Dan @ Code Town

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-11-2005 20:22

With regard to the RFID technology and tracking of inventory, that is only the first step. In the near future you will also pay using RFID. You will go into a store, fill your cart, and walk out, the amount automatically deducted from your account. Proposed methods of payment include anything from a bank card with RFID all the way to thumb scan or implant. Might sound crazy, but this has been thoroughly discussed in a number of trade publications.

This is our future in the technologically advanced global economy where corporations have infiltrated government.

quote:
100-0 is just a ridiculous amount of support considering the outcry against this. If this doesn't show corruption of the system, then I do not know what does.



Well, thats the trick. By inserting it into a hodge-podge of war spending, including good stuff like better payouts to the families of dead soldiers, even if certain senators were against it, it would have been political suicide come 2006. So much for standing on principle, re-election is more important. I'll wager most of the morons in DC didn't even read the damn thing.

I watched them pass it on C-Span, and what really sucked is they did not even debate it. Frustrating but no surprise. Did they debate the Patriot Act? Did they debate Patriot II? Nope. IIRC, they passed the PA during the manufactured anthrax scare, and the PAII during the staged capture of Hussein.

Then, you look at the mainstream media coverage and you hear nothing, except sporadic claims that they passed supplemental spending which included "immigration reform," which was the disguise. The ones that did cover it were totally off the mark on what it is. I read the damn thing, and it is scary. You don't haver to be a lawyer to understand what it says.

I did find this little statement released by Sensenbrenner:

quote:
"The REAL ID is vital to preventing foreign terrorists from hiding in plain sight while conducting their operations and planning attacks. By targeting terrorist travel, the REAL ID will assist in our War on Terror efforts to disrupt terrorist operations and help secure our borders.

"I am grateful for the White House's strong support of this border security legislation. In addition, Senators Frist, McConnell, Santorum, Specter, Kyl, Sessions, Brownback, DeWine, and Cornyn were among those very helpful in shepherding this legislation through the Senate and I wish to thank them."



Wow, don't you feel more secure now? Those terrorists will never get us now.

The good news is some states are looking to fight this thing and we have 3 years to make others aware of what is going on. Not an easy task, the citizens of the US, by and large, take freedom for granted since that is all they have known.

Ramasax

cyoung
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Home
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 05-12-2005 02:08

The only thing I heard about this on the radio today was that there would be tougher regulations on getting drivers licenses, which was unanimously supported. I suppose we should all feel privileged to carry one. The media has become a toothless, sleeping watchdog.

An interesting quote from a nobody like me.. my father; he told me, "If that's what this has come to then BinLaden has won. Time to find a new place to live." He was (understandably) a little alarmed.

Thing is, most people are clueless, and the vast majority of those won't take a position until it's the party line to do so, which won't happen. The only thing politicians respond to is pressure and considering the vote and the tendency of the people toward intense party loyalty I have to wonder if it will. Or maybe I'm just a pessimist.

This stuff is really scary if you ponder the possibilities even briefly, and the fact that no restrictions at all were placed on homeland security compound that fear. They're not limited to current technology and they can change the rules practicly on a whim. Maybe we should just all be barcoded and implanted at birth, then we could do away with those troublesome ID's people keep losing and faking.

Frankly, I'd rather take my chances with terrorists.

2¢- for what it's worth

WebShaman
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 05-12-2005 03:14

You know, I never, ever thought there would come a day in American History, when certain parts of the Constitution might become necessary for the People to actually use.

But the last 5 years have radically turned alot of things upside down, and has brought the unbelievable one step closer to being possible.

Has America gone nuts?!

WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-12-2005 03:16

There will be war.

I can not yet see if it will be silent and swift, or loud and bloody, but there will be war. We will wake up and, we will, in unity shout, "Where is my country?." We will cry, "Where is my freedom." And we will fight to take it back.

You are not your material goods, you are not the amount of money in your bank, you are not your debt. But if you do not realize that you are a slave.

You are your thoughts, you are your ideas, you are your freedom. Without these then you are a slave. We will not, we do not accept that we are being made into slaves. We will fight, and we will die, but we will win.

Be prepared, the time is coming, still distant, as we are slow to wake. You will have to stand up, and you will have to fight. And you will choose freedom, because, without freedom you have nothing.

Dan @ Code Town

(Edited by WarMage on 05-12-2005 03:18)

Ramasax
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: PA, US
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 05-12-2005 04:55

Well said WarMage, let's just hope when the masses awaken it is not too late.

Here is a neat little story that kind of fits the mood of the conversation. A little over a month ago, my water company, American Water, was doing work in the neighborhood. Actually, they were doing work in my yard, for about 3 days straight. Five vehicles and about ten guys working on the same 20 meter stretch of sewer. They said there was a rootball they were getting rid of.

Anyways, they would come at about 5PM and not get done until about 11PM. You know the routine, half the guys were lounging about the whole time. On the third night I had finally had enough. I went out around 9PM and kindly asked the guys to leave my property, as my family was trying to sleep and they were out there with flashing lights and clanging metal noises and power tools. They told me no.

I then called the police thinking they would do something for me, but the police showed up and told me to go in my house and to not "harass" the "public" employees. When I refused, I was arrested for disorderly conduct in my own damn yard. I recited my first, fourth and fifth amendment rights that he was violating, and he laughed at me. Told me if I didn't shut my mouth I was going to have resisting arrest added to the list and be taken to the county jail.

If that was not enough, I then did a litle research into American Water, and found out that they are a subsidiary of a multi-national, German headquartered corporation, RWE Thames. I believe now they run about 14 states water supply here on the east coast and they are #1 in the USA, #3 in the world. In looking back at some of the local media for the past couple years, they have been going into small municipalities in a bunch of states and buying up water rights left and right. You know, offer a small town a couple hundred grand and take over their water system. Seems like a good deal to them.

So basically, I was arrested for protesting on my own property against a corporation, whom the cop insisted was an employeee of the municipality. The workers were from Florida.

Might seem insignificant to some, but to me it only solidified the opinion I had been forming. Comply...or else. That is not freedom. If we are not secure on our own property when we protest a corporation's actions, or anyone's actions for that matter, are we secure in our rights anywhere? I want my rights, more importantly I want future generations to have rights, and I have drawn my line, and I will fight with everything I have to secure them. I would rather die than succumb to what is being crafted around me.

I prefer to do it through peaceful means, but would I fight for that freedom, and die for that freedom if it came down to it? Yes. Never felt stronger about anything in my life.

Ramasax

Thumper
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Deeetroit, MI. USA
Insane since: Mar 2002

posted posted 05-13-2005 09:26

I have been talking about this with people...friends, family, etc. Funny thing, they haven't heard of it and the conversation is typically shrugged off. I seriously have doubts that a resistance to this will occur on a large scale. Things like this make me feel like humanity is becoming more and more synthetic...

WarMage
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Rochester, New York, USA
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 05-13-2005 20:20

It is your job to wake them up. You need to present them with the full arguments that go along with it.

Ask them if they would like to be mandated to carry around an item that can track their every movement? Ask them if they feel it is their right to be spied on wherever they go?

It takes a very loud voice in order to redirect peoples attention from the record that the government has been playing.

The government plays a record, "Everything is alright, we protect you from terrorists, go buy a big mac, pay your taxes, we are doing what is best for you."

You need to stand up, and you need to shout over this drone, "The government is lying to you! You are losing your freedom! You are not being made safe! If you do not act you will be a slave!"

And you can not just do this once, but you have to do this over and over again, you have to be loud, you have to be smart, and you have to be honest. You can not let people you love get lulled into this false sense of security that is going to rob them of their freedom and their humanity. It is your duty, if you want to protect your family and your friends to let them know of the horrors that are coming and that not everything is alright.

Dan @ Code Town

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