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tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 13:16

Well lookie no further, but of course you will need a digital display.....


http://www.the3dshop.com/productinfo.asp?a_prodid=1108

Wes
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Inside THE BOX
Insane since: May 2000

posted posted 03-04-2003 14:08

You know, I used to work for a schmuck who would buy stuff like this for us just so he could brag about how much he spent on equipment. He'd get visible annoyed when I didn't act impressed that he would buy it when we didn't need it.

Then, when he would sit down with me and go over exactly what I needed to do the work he wanted me to do, he'd order it, then never let me have it.


InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 14:17

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

Suho1004
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: Seoul, Korea
Insane since: Apr 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 15:12

Most of the specs on that thing are way over my head. I got myself a Radeon as well when my Nvidia bit the dust from too many Neverwinter Nights sessions. Granted, I don't play NWN anymore, but I've had no complaints with my Radeon so far. I can't imagine I would ever need a graphics card that cost that much... it would be wasted on me.

tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 16:10

Hey Ini, which radeon ya got, didnt know they made a pro series card....

if you are on about the home pc games accelerator ..... you said you had in your new pc... ya need to read up a bit on the hardware....


this isnt the geforce series, this is their pro level card.......

now if you are right on this one....let me know because i could do with a pro series card at 300$.

Try reading the specs again

[This message has been edited by tomeaglescz (edited 03-04-2003).]

[This message has been edited by tomeaglescz (edited 03-04-2003).]

InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 16:36

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 17:00

OK I see you deleted ya last post and toned ya content down by a factor of a million:

Quadro: were the company who's technology was the leading edge in GPU's for 3d work (as in professional work stations) their cards were unmatched by any manufacturer's.

All That has happened is NVIDIA brought the company, and re labelled it.

Now i am asuming for a moment that you are right (hypothetically speaking this is)..

Do you honestly think, that a company could charge 1300 $ more for a card that would be out performed by a games card????

This is not a 3d accelerator for use at home, this is for the professional end of the market working with freaking huge 3D Objects

but to add food for thought

Toms Hardware:

click here for the 5800 standard version not the quadro
side by side specs again only the 5800 not the quadro its big brother

now ,maybe, maybe i am right, but i forgot:

I am Never,Never,Ever allowed to try and tell you about hardware,3d programming etc...

stop being an ass Ini, you are great at what you do, problem is you dont do everything, this made you look stupid, i have been into 3d more than half your lifetime, stop trying to be the big "I am".

Now if the home version of the fx series beats the 9700, what do you think the quadro will do?????

To Put the Qudro 2000 FX into perpective click here:

benchmarks against leading competition in pro end market

remember the higher the score the better


So to put the cheap shots aside; all i ask is this, is how do you come to the following conclusions:

a:A radeon 9700 pro out performs the Quadro fx 2000???, when it cant even match the home version....
b:its quote "outdated shit" when this is recognised as the fastest and best gpu in its class???

but then you being in a position of unquestionable knoweledge, far superior to mine (so you suggest) will have all these facts and figures availiable, if and when you find any to support your stand...

Like i said Ini, you are damn good at somethings, but act like a jerk sometimes, i know we seem to but heads sometimes, but i have learned one thing from those moments.. To pick and choose when to question your points, as now i havent seen anything to support your case anywheer on the web, either at the radeon site,nvidia,or any independant hardware reviews. But obviuosly you know better, so please show me how i can get the performance of an QUADRO FX 2000 from a 9700 pro...

hell i can save myself about 1300 $ and maybe a few other people would be interested in buying that performance at the cost of a home gfx card



[This message has been edited by tomeaglescz (edited 03-04-2003).]

tj333
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Manitoba, Canada
Insane since: Oct 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 19:39

Yes a want a new video card.

But with college starting in 2 weeks I think i want the $1,690 more.

Would be nice to see how that would run some of the 3d models that I work with.



__________________________
"Show me a sane person and I will cure him for you."-Carl Jung

InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 20:12

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 20:54

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

Dufty
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Where I'm from isn't where I'm at!
Insane since: Jun 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:01

I gave a GForceII Pro and I've never been happier with a graphics card in all my years of using computers of one type or another. It does exactly what I need it to do... no more, no less.

Seems like a serious waste of cash to me, but then I have a friend who would disagree.
The industry relies on people like him.

Dracusis
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: Brisbane, Australia
Insane since: Apr 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:01

"Quadro fx is a Geforce 5800 + some features. A few"

Yah sure, but those 'few' are quite worth the extra money.

The main difference you pay for with the Professional level GL cards (The Quadro is Nvidia's Pro card, the Fire GL is ATI's Pro card) is the extra work done on the drivers (drivers that are certified and tested with apps like Maya, Lightwave and Max, which costs a lot of money to do, somthng you wonldn't worry about wor a comercial card) and precisely how the card is configured. These cards are designed to give hardware level support for a lot of the effects in programs like 3DS Max and Maya. These are the kind of cards that the people at Pixar would use (Actually, I think they use something a little more insane that rakes in around the 10 grand mark, the pro GL cards based on the commercial gamer chipsets are considered "entry level" workstation cards).

Most commercial desktop 3D cards (Nvidia Geforce FX, ATI Radeon 9700 Pro) are optimised for games (Direct X and Open GL) and not workstation 3D apps. That's not to say that these cards can't be used for 3D apps, they just won't support it any where near as well as the Professional series does and their often not configured to provide optimal performance in these kind of situations. Hardware level support for a 3D app like Maya when youíre working on something like the Ice Age movie is a lot different to rendering a scene in UT 2003.

Furthermore, the Fire GL and Quadro cards aren't good for games... in fact, most of them have issues with Direct X related apps (read, games) simply because there's not much point supporting it. Although this all depends on how the word "Pro" is defined. Many professional game developers simply donít need Professional level GL cards as the amount of polygon's their working with and the limited amount of 3D technologies they use (compared to Movie and Film level stuff) while authoring the content for their games isn't required. On the other hand, 3D movies and special effects is more than just a different fish, it's not even a water creature thus you'd be wanting a different kind of chef to cook it.

As for the Geforce FX vs the Radeon 9700 Pro... Technically, the Geforce FX is better. Practically the FX is better too but as things currently stand the Geforce FX is underperforming it's specifications by quite a bit. Possibly due to poor drivers and a lack of any software that'll let it flex it's muscles good and proper. The 9700 Pro is very close on its heels though and well, for the price it's a much smarter purchase. Besides, the 9700 Pro has been around the block a bit and a lot of the early issues it had have been resolved. The 9700 is tried and tested tech now, the Geforce FX is still in it's teething stages. Although ATI will be releasing their next generation of the R300 technology soon and that's likely to do to the FX what the 9700 Pro did to the Geforce 4ti.

Still, the Geforce FX and the Radeon 9700 Pro cards are overkill for just about any game currently on the market. Currently no game exists that uses Direct X 9 features. The only app that does use DX9 is the new 3DMark, but lets' face it, with the current price curves in the commercial video card market, anything above a Geforce 4ti is just wank material.

Edit: Dufty, wicked sig man.




[This message has been edited by Dracusis (edited 03-04-2003).]

tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:25

ini, lol

So we finally got somewhere, back to where i started, as i work in 3d i want a pro (short for professional) level card....

Note in the Quadro no pro is used....

My whole point was and still is, if you have the cash and need a great entry-mid level graphics card, when working in maya,max lightwave etc, then the new Quadro FX 2000 is the way to go, compare it to the others in that link i showed you it leaves all the competition dead.

as for the 5800 well that weighs in at 399$ the same price as the 9700 pro was on release...

NVIDIA and ATI are at the stage where VooDoo from 3dfx were against Nvidia, it can only be healthy, one thing for sure, these are both monster cards, and with full direct x 9 support (even though games utilizing this are a long way away yet).


And back to your quote from my source

quote:
Radeon 9700 PRO cards are only slightly slower



methinks that says it all....

but if anyone wants a handy tip that has a geforce 2 or 3 lying around and wants a quadro performance let me know, i know how to unlock the drivers... (its the same gpu) unfortunately in the force 4 series they did away with the software lock.

and before anyone says anything its not illegal....

and as for arogance, a little never hurt anyone, its the post ya deleted that got my back up


and have you got q or msn, would like to chat to you away from the asylum about bits n pieces...

my q is in my profile and messenger is same as my email addy in profile.

Dracusis:ya right about the software being availiable to let the cards flex their muscles. Unfortunately as there is only 1 direct x 9 game with a beta public version around, its going to be a while before we see anything like the promise either card holds for the future.

But at $399 for the home version, and with the way the market runs, the price will drop soon, but i doubt by much as the actual hardware is that much more advanced (and with it expensive) ..

anyway anyone got $1690....????? i need a decent card in max my 4400 ti is dragging its heels a bit, but as it was a freebie i dont mind.




InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:32

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

Dracusis
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: Brisbane, Australia
Insane since: Apr 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:34

4400ti... freebie.... damn, you need to introduce me to your friends. =)

Actually, I'm running a ATI 8500 nowadays. It holds up quite well with all things considered. My next upgrade probably won't be until the start of next year. I think it'll all depend on how the 8500's perform on the DOOM III engine but things look sweet and run smoothly in the new UT warfare engine so I'm quite contempt to sit on what I have for the time being.

INI, the wank material statement was purely my personal opinion -- and yes, the FX release was surrounded by lots of negatives but personally, I thought the online reviewers spent way too much time harping on about things like the cooler noise and the "more expensive" PCB complexity when they didn't even know the street price yet. The FX has a lot of issues, no one can disagree there that but it also has the "potential" to seriously kick the 9700 Pro out of the ballpark. But it didnt, it should have but it didn't. Reminds me a lot of the Radeon 8500 release actually. On paper the Radeon 8500 flogged the Geforce 3, in reality it was a bit of a letdown. Nowadays, the 8500's drivers are much healthier and it does lick the Geforce 3's, but who cares about Geforce 3's when you have technology that's 2 generations ahead.

A classic case of too little too late and I have a feeling that's what'll happen with the Geforce FX. Once it does resolve it's issues the next generation of graphics cards will be hogging the lime light and it'll never get a chance to clear it's tarnished name. Although I'm hoping Nvidia's experience in the industry will rattle up something that'll really make ATI work for the crown. The competition not only means the market prices are kept low but that the technology keeps getting pushed to it's limits.

[This message has been edited by Dracusis (edited 03-04-2003).]

tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 21:42

drac:Jump on a plane, get it to turn left at hong kong:i'm that bit stuck between germany austria and poland and slovakia

edit:did i mention the gb of ram i got given aswell (pc 1066) sdram

wasnt exactly free just had to change the motherboard cpu memory and upgrade his video card.

gave me the bits he didnt want....

so take out a few hours work from the freebie part....

plus i got cash on top... (helps to be on of the few english speaking techy type people in the city)

InI
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Somewhere over the rainbow
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted posted 03-04-2003 22:34

The poster has demanded we remove all his contributions, less he takes legal action.
We have done so.
Now Tyberius Prime expects him to start complaining that we removed his 'free speech' since this message will replace all of his posts, past and future.
Don't follow his example - seek real life help first.

tomeaglescz
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Czech Republic via Bristol UK
Insane since: Feb 2002

posted posted 03-04-2003 23:07

I am adding some things to the FAQ tomorrow, about 3d cards but care should be used when using them, i am putting together some stuff on how to safely use the links etc first. It was Ini's suggestion that i link them so stay tuned....




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