Preserved Topic: Chronic Depression and what I can do

Hey everyone,
I dont know why I didnt do this earlier but I thought I would ask all of you about this particular topic. Yes we all experience degress of depression and know people who have, etc. The reason why Im asking what I can do about this is not because I suffer from it really, but its my sister I am concerned about. We aint related, just close friends who are so close its pretty much a brother\sister relationship. She suffers from acute chronic depression. She's been like this for quite a while, for a few years in fact so its well and truly stuck in her system and not just a phrase. (Wish it was tho). She has the lowest levels of self-esteem and self-confidence you could ever come across. She had really bad achne back in Yr 9 (3 yrs ago now, shes currently 17 and doing final year of College).
She has tried cutting her arm before because she gets so down and thinks about dying and what not. Shes a Christian and her parents, I find, are nice and the family environment seems pleasant. Her parents are together and has a younger sister. She has a boyfriend (whom she is sure they are going to be getting engaged at the end of this year after school). She has friends, isnt fat, and is quite attarctive I think. In fact, MANY pple think she is attractive but this drives her insane as she HATES complements.

Reason Im telling you these details is so the problem of this depression goes through quite often can be pinpointed and explain to you the case I have here.

I guess as a normal 17 yo girl would say, she thinks she doesnt have any friends, is ugly, fat, cant do anything right, etc...etc.....etc..etc and that no one would miss her when if she were to go.

We have been friends for the past 2, going on 3, years now. We have liked each other (in that way) on and off but circumstances decide otherwise. Due to this, we have become real close. She is the sister that I never had and I will not let anything happen to her nor let her think of doing such things as killing herself cos of her depression. Also she's not on any drugs. Recently tonight she SMS me and said she wanted to die and I asked her to try and think when she feels like this so as to pinpoint why she gets depressed. Most of the time, if not all, she has no idea why. She gets REALLY upset as well over small things, such as making me laugh last night and I had to spit out all this blood from my mouth (due to recent wisdom teeth removal).

She also sees the school psychologist but Im not sure as to whether this helps her or not. Im really vexed as to what I can do to snap her out of this. I mean I have a fair idea kinda but not sure as to whether I am on the right path or not. If she's wanting to die already at the start of this year then what will she be like when the real stress and strain of final year College hits her?

Maybe someone here has similiar experiences, or some advice, or something. I really dont know how else to explain this. But what I do know is that Im not going to have her suffer and talk of wanting to die.

"You don't know how paralysing that is, that stare of a blank canvas, which says to the painter: you can't do a thing." - Vincent Van Gogh

Well, luko,
you certainly aren't in an easy situation.
Let me tell you, you're certainly not the first person to go through such a dilema.
I personally know at least three persons with similar problems, and have been rather close (nearly too close once) to two of them.
To sum my experiences up, here is what I'd advice:
-Stay Alert. If she tells you that she wants to die somewhere out in the field, and later tells you, for example online, that she'll go for a walk, you should continue putting two and two together. Make sure you're appropriatly equipped for the weather though. (You freezing to death is not the gameplan). Oh, and figure out a) wether you'd tell anybody about it afterwards. Depends on the surroundings, of course and b) whether you even want to stop her, or if it's not everyone's right to die if they want to.

-As far as I'am aware, school psychologists are neither psychatrists, nor allowed to presribe drugs. Now, the whole field is rather spotty on the science part, and big on the optinion part, and you should get her to check out any number of psychatrists, until you found the right one. Remember, if she does get on drugs, make sure she stays away from alcohol and other stuff. They do not mix well.
-Talk to the parents. Find out wether they can be of support, or wether they are part of the problem.
-Get someone else who's rather sensitive involved with her. It's wise to consider that she might suddenly, without any reason at all, turn from you. That is the moment you want to have the third person to stay informed.

so long,
TP

PS: Feel free to email me anytime. Understand that I do not wish to discuss my experiences here in more detail.

luxo i agree with what tp has said. you are definately in a hard position.
my best friend's sister-in-law suffer's from serious manic depression. being around her is like being on a roller coaster because one minute she's happy and joking and "whatever" happens and she's either very sad or angry or she's having an anxiety attack. while i don't agree with people being put on drugs for things like this, i do think that some people really NEED to be on drugs. this particular person, at the urging of everyone around her, did get help and got drugs. "when" she takes her medication it definately keeps her in balance, but she doesn't see anyone to help with what's causing this, so when she feels better, she quits taking her meds and the whole ugly circle starts over again.

you should definately talk to your friend and tell her how concerned you are! i also think that you should talk to her parents, no matter what. they can't help if they don't know what's going on. keep in mind that talking to her parents may push her away from you. it's fine that she's talking to the school psychologist, she should really also get professional help. there are SO many services around to help teenagers and they are usually free and totally confidential. as a matter of fact, you can call these places and they can give you help in helping your friend. here is a link that will point you in the right direction: Yellow Ribbon

good luck and feel free to email or Q me!

Luxo_Jr: Its a tricky one Manic depression and depression are common on my mother's side of the family so here are a few suggestions:

1. She needs to see a doctor who would send her to a trained counsellor/psychologist.

2. I'd suggest she svoid thm prescribing drugs as they can be nasty things (members of my family have been on various things up to Lithium and ECT and it is pretty crude) - she should try St. John's Wort. There should be some reasonably priced offers in some chemists and supermarkets. There are plenty of resources out there but see:
www.herba-medica.com/remedies/saintjohn.html

3. Dig out some support websites to point her to there must be plenty of places where people can discuss things online (both people who have been through this and come out the other side and people suffering similar problems) as it might help her to anonymousy discuss this kind of thing with peers.

And of course you are doing the best thing you can by being her friend

___________________
Emps

FAQs: Emperor

I must disagree with Emperor, most of these self help websites I did not find usefull, and they have a certain tendency to cause 'attacks' in people who injure themselves.

This sounds so familiar .... I have a 17 year old daugther who had very similar problems. She has a friend that really cared and called the police because she wrote a sucicide note and he took it serious thank god.

With the help of the school and friends we set up a safetynet for her depending on how she rated herself. We set up a system where she had to rate her feelings on a scale from 1 to 10. 10 being the worst.

If she was a 6 she would go to her contact person at school and take a break from it all, 7 the school would call me and I would get her, if she reached 9 she would be taken to the crisis clinic and on it goes.

What made a difference was to be able to talk having access to people that knew how she felt and she could communicate and deep down she knew they cared about her.

Teenage Depression is a very common occurance this days and it needs to be taken serious.
Medically speeking it is refered to as a chemical imbalance in the brain. Only problem with this is that medicine, according to my information, is not able to pinpoint which chemical it is that is out of whack. So you are in other words literally turned into a medical guinee pig. Oh well lets try this pill for 8 weeks and see what happens, then lets increase the dose - lets add this pill and on it goes. In other words take pill and you will be happy again - hopefully.


I have to agree with TP stay alert and listen, be a friend she obiously trusts you !!! It is hard and can be hell at times because you want to help and you cann't reach her. But being there for her and her knowing that at least someone cares will make a difference.

I admire your courage going through this with your friend !! She is a very lucky girl she has you :-)

sib

Just an afterthought here - we all tend to look at the big pictures. We tend to forget the little things and those are so important.

Low self-esteem ? Why? perhaps the expectations we have put upon on us are intimating, frighting, overwhelming? and it makes you feel inadequate?

So many question and so few answers ......

There are different levels of depression, and as I've been here for a while I've seen our very own inmates go through some really low times that you feel like theres no light at the end of this long tunnel we call life.

I dont know if I'm a victim, as for the past few weeks I've been going through a 'rollercoaster' as someone earlier put it. At times I feel so down and depressed for no reason at all ,that nothing can cheer me or get me out of this state. I'm usually moody and dont want to talk to anyone, I lash out at my fellow employees and very hostile mood but nothing violent.

Then I snap and get back to my usual self, a very jolly person, everyone listens when I talk and I get along with people easily. I'm also abit shy and afraid to make eye contact with the opposite sex most of the times.
Like last nite me and my friends went out for a soul nite dance, usually when I've taken a few drinks, Im usually very out-going and dance with strangers you know, the works so there I was last nite so so afraid to dance or talk to anyone and the most weird thing is that I wanted some company, I just danced alone looking like a total fool and that really made me think hard about myself and what exactly causes these flips in my character.

I'm probably not making much sense right now, but I just had to get that off my chest., I dont know if anyone has gone through something similar to this...Or I'm just going through Quarter life crisis

PS. Luxo Jr, I do hope you find a solution for your friend, but as someone who's going through some tough times, all I can tell you is to be a friend to her. I usually dont feel comfortable talking to my friends about this.

[This message has been edited by kaboi (edited 02-03-2003).]

Seems like everyone else has you covered so there isn't anything I can add.

My mates? wife has the same problem, not an easy thing to deal with but she's slowly getting better through counselling and medication.

Best of luck with it? - you sound like a true friend.

Tyberius Prime: Thanks mate. I will stay alert and be wary of any strange things she says she is going to do. Yeah Im a bit dubious about talking to her parents, they are approacable I guess, but Im damn sure she wont like me talking to them about her problems. I am planning to talk to her boyfriend though, this can be easily done across MSN if I want to keep it confidential. I understand about not going into your experiences here more but I will keep the idea of emailing in mind just in case.

Lacuna: Thanks to you as well. Im really juggling the idea of talking to her parents, I might leave it to my own discretion seen I know what they are like the circumstance as it is. I think its a double-bladed sword. I will fee free to drop you a line as well. Thanks man.

Emperor: Cheers mate for the link and advice


sib: Thanks dude for the complement, means alot to me. Just one of those people I guess.


kaboi: Thanks for your input as well. I hope things go easy for you as well. Things have a funny way of working out for the best in the end. Ive had similiar experiences to your "rollercoaster" ride but not for a long time. Strangely I seem to get depressed a bit on Saturday nights only when Im stuck at home. I guess its the "night-clubbing on a Saturday night" instinct in me being suppressed by being at home:P

Dracusis: Thanks for the well-wishes.

I asked her the other night over MSN if she could pinpoint what causes the depression, what causes it, what thoughts lead to it, whats she doing at the time, down to what room she is in. Sometime I find myself getting affected by the environment and settings and leading occasionally to light depression. She didnt know what causes it and that she gets depressed over the phone alot particularly to her boyfriend. I asked her to write down when the bouts of depression hit her, answering what she was thinking, any random thoughts, what she was doing beforehand, etc. I said to her maybe doing this form of expressionism will pinpoint something out to her and myself as well. Also we might find a pattern as to why she gets depressed so often.

"You don't know how paralysing that is, that stare of a blank canvas, which says to the painter: you can't do a thing." - Vincent Van Gogh

Luxo_Jr - my own sister suffers from a a similar disorder, and recently discovered that she may really be suffering from what's known as Borderline Personality Disorder. Here's a link that might be helpful. It talks about the therapy that's been developed to help people who suffer from BPD

DBT

One of the main characteristics of BPD is a strong desire to hurt oneself. My sister also cuts on herself. She says she does it because it helps her to release the pain she feels inside. (I've never quite understood it, but I understand that SHE has a reason for it, and therefore feels justified - not that that makes it right...) The emotions of people who suffer this disorder are like an uncovered nerve. Hyper-sensitive! In July, when I went to visit her in Boston, I spent most of my time there trying to convince her that suicide was not an option, and that if she couldn't find a reason within herself to stay alive, she needed to think hard about the people in her life that do care about her, and stay alive for us, if nothing else. It's been a difficult road, and I truly sympathize with you, for the position you are in, as a close friend of someone who can't, for whatever reason, see their own worth.
My sister is in the care of a psychiatrist, and on medication. Since she's stopped drinking, they gave her Xanex, which seems to help somewhat. She has also recently started the DBT therapy, and seems to be making some progress. A psychologist is helpful if your problems are not physiological. BPD appears to be caused in part by a chemical imbalance in the brain during development, and medication can sometimes correct that. Remember that being on medication is not the cure for a disorder like depression, it's only a support mechanism until the patient finds a way to deal with the feelings that they are having. Your friend should make it a priority to retain a qualified psychiatrist to help her deal with her feelings and her physiology. She'll make better progress.

For yourself, it can be quite painful, and very distressing to watch someone you care about descend into darkness like this. Make sure that you also have access to some sort of counselor (priest or psychologist) who can help you deal with your feelings regarding your friend's distress. Make yourself available and supportive to your friend when she needs someone close to talk to. Try to avoid telling her how she "should" feel, but emphasize that there are joys in life, even though it's not peachy-keen all the time. Tell her over and over how much you care about her as a person, and how happy you are that she is part of your life. Remind her of the fun times you've had together, and how she's enriched the lives of those around her. It can seem redundant after a while, to constantly have to remind someone of these things, but it's definitely worth the time and effort you expend.
My sister tells me that she knows in her mind that there are people who care about her, but that she doesn't always retain that "feeling" after those people have left her presence. I don't know if your friend has similar issues, but being available by telephone if nothing else is a good way to help her remember that you are there. My sister and I have a great deal of distance between us, as she lives in Boston, and I am here in North Carolina. We stay in contact almost daily by telephone and by email. When I haven't heard from her in a couple of days, I get concerned and make a point to call her. The more time passes from that weekend in July, the better she is doing. I am confident these days that her life is not in any danger from herself, and that she is learning valuable coping skills with which to make it through her daily life, and she is finding ways to experience joy on a more daily level as well.
There is a great deal of hope for your friend, as long as she has loving support from you, and all of her friends, and from her family. If she can recognize that she truly has a problem, and that there is a solution to it, she can overcome this very real, and very debilitating disorder.

My heart goes out to anyone who suffers from chronic depression, whether it's just a temporary bout now and then, or a daily struggle to live. Regardless of the daily struggle to make it in this complicated world we live in, life is worth living, if only to experience the love of our family and friends, and the wonders of the world itself.

Bodhi - Cell 617

[This message has been edited by bodhi23 (edited 02-05-2003).]