Preserved Topic: Plugins

How many of you use KPT plugins and others in your work? Just a small question.

As for me I'm a straight PS user. I tried it when it came out but, I'll stick with PS cause you can't learn everything in this program. But, if I want to make a cool sphere I will look at KPT to make it shine. So I guess it's 98% PS and 2% KPT.

/Allgood

I have no plug-ins...

So, Im a 100% photoshop user..!


- Dan -

100% Photoshop also! I've learned how to do what all the major plugins can do and then some....

when i started using photoshop... uhm... 4 years ago (boy, it sure doesn't show) i used a lot of plug-ins.

but with more experience and whatnot, i've discovered i don't use them at all anymore. pretty much because i believe they're weak and don't offer enough control over what's going on.

they are a good starting point though, if not overdone to death!

cheers.mikey.milker

I use KPT 3-5-6 and EyeCandy.........there tools and good ones.....plus the pen tools from wacom and some sandwater filters.......i dont care where the effects come from..PS has some great ones...but ill also go into painter 6 for some real cool filters...especialy the chrome brush in Painter.....wow.....you can never have enough imagination or tools..........Cyber

Don't get me wrong I can do it all with out plug-ins, but why do it 100% photoshop if there are plugins that can do it quicker.

Rock On! I used to use Eye Candy ALL the time when I firast started, but I finally realised how bad it really is when someone pointed it out to me.

Now I use pure photoshop, including for my spheres.




Lepricosa...The Leprosy Ointment. For when your not half the man you used to be.

When I learned Photoshop I used Eye Candy as a crutch until I could run on my own in PS. Without that crutch (eye candy) I find that I am more creative because I explore other avenues when trying to accomplish certain graphic effects. Many, many times I've stumbled onto really awesome effects that I otherwise wouldn't have known how to do if I was still limping along with Eye Candy (or other plugs).



[This message has been edited by Boudga (edited 14-06-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Boudga (edited 14-06-2000).]

Plug-ins are for Shmug-ins, <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">
They are for a fools quickly parted with their wonga, anything achievable with plug-in is achievable with PS......period.
Plug-in writers prey on the lazy minds of wannabe artists, a plug-in is a plug-in , anything produced by it is so obviously a plug-in.
I try them all and they all come up second best to what you can achieve
using a combination of skill, patience, and perseverence.
The only use i find for plug-ins, is when I apply a little lateral thinking and produce something with a plug-in that looks nothing like the plug-in intended........after a few tweaks that is.
Even then i look at the effect and work out how they came up with it, and then reproduce it using conventional techniques........if you can't be bothered to do that , then stick with the plug-ins.....your work will always have the plug-in label attached to it.
For beginners....no problem......load up your plug, go WOW, but then realise you can ALWAYS achieve far greater results if you actually commit yourself to taming this beast of a program.
I see plug-in manufacturers as the commercial exploiters of the Photoshop world, all they want is your money .......they could'nt give a flying f**k about your artistic capabilities.
If someone could produce the ultimate plug-in that would have all the neccessary parameters to achieve the desired results..it would be called Photoshop.

whoa lighten up "francis" it was an innocent question not intended to touch that sensitive nerve! (heh) docyber uses them and we all know that his work rocks....

Hey.........2wins the names r@m , and not francis,...whatever ,....... as far as somebodys work "rockin" ...that's a matter of opinion............
this is a forum , somewhere where you post your thoughts, if you can't handle them, maybe you shouldn't read them , I certainly don't need to lighten up <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">
.....do you?

Excuuuuusse me mr. r@m, shmam, spam, whatever the hell your name is...listen up..."lighten up francis" is a term borrowed from a humorous comedy movie salled "Stripes" in the states....it's a term that the good old sarge used to deal with this guy named francis who preferred to be called "Psycho" Any relation there wham?

As for your so called "expertise" and defensiveness, my suggestion is to put your shields down and lighten up...

your freaking way ain't the only way, and just because someone else's methods differ from yours doesn't give you the right to blast your crap all over this forum and stink up the place.

I say DocCyber's work is rocking and if YOU can't handle my posts the I suggest YOU don't read them!

Besides, if memory serves me right I'm not the only one you couldn't take a joke from.

Get a life...

I think what 2winspapa was saying was .....lets not turn photoshop into a religeon.....and then seperate the flock because someone uses another tool .........r@m you havin a bad day or something......all tools in the hands of a pro are quality tools and ive never seen any filters that you couldnt tweek to perfection........i go thru this all the time with airbrush artist.......if your not using the 300 dollar fancy gun your work sucks..well ive humbled quite a few airbrushers with my 50 dollar paasche.......so there again its not the tool its the artist.........yes PS rocks but its only a gamma manipulator and guess what so arnt the other filters.......how many different ways can you grey scale an object then give it a value......this isnt a religeon its digital art.......and this thread is approaching a dangerouse seperation that is base on bias opinions.........use all the technology and learn it well..................or find your work painted in a corner by someone who can use them all..................................that was just an opinoin but one based on equality for all things.........and r@m please dont sarcasticly emulate my writing style ive done nothing to you.........never mind............DocCyber

[This message has been edited by DocCyber (edited 15-06-2000).]

You know it's not about filters, it's about how you use the tools. A carpenter can use a hand saw or they can use a powered circular saw. Both get the job done, one makes life much easier.

However to go a step further, Ozone use the lighting effects filter, and the Lens Flare Filter frequently. Sure those effects can be produced without filters, but the filters make things so much easier. Goto {URL]http://www.blueskyheart.com[/URL] and look at the work there, he makes extensive use of KPT and Fade/Filter Undo. Myself I use KTP with most everything that I do, sometimes it's jsut to get a little extra from filter. I also use Eyecandy 99.9% of the time for my drop shadows, I like the effect, and I can do it with a few clicks.

Filters are not bad, filters used poorly are bad.

AW MAN!!!! I'M PISSED OFF!!!!

shiet, i just spent 10 minutes writing a nice little note and then i deleted it by accident, hahaha... well anyways, let's try again.

everyone play nice, okay? i can see where r@m initially was coming from and i laughed my ass off when i read his first post... it was one person's own opinion and shouldn't be taken personally. of course r@m WAS a little abrasive, but what the hell!

well, i'm out of time and i've gotta split...

just respect eachother's own beliefs and try to chill out when presenting your own. and please, please, please.. no personal attacks/insults, okay???

ah, now this message sucks and i sound like a ninny, argh. bollocks to it all.

cheers.mikey.milker

Go papa, go papa!

**dancing a funky dance**

ANy-hoo....to address part of this topic, filters are filters. Photoshop is a tool to make graphics design easier. The added filters as they went to make it even easier. And then they added more to make it easier. And again. Got the picture? So...the way I see it....included filters or 3rd party filter -- I don't see how it makes any difference. If anybody (I won't mention anybody by name or anything...) is extremely biased against filters, I guess that would mean they are against using the included filters from Photoshop too right? <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/wink.gif">

Anyway, this is *just* my opinion <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">

Thanks Milky , for being the only person "not" to take this as a personal
attack ...I could be drawn by quite a few of the above defensive remarks, and get involved in a long drawn out tedious, pointless, drivel...........
but I've been there, done that ........ <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/redface.gif">
Why someone has to attack me personaly because of my opinions?
and try to pull this thread down into a cheap slanging match.....lol
Like i said , been there done that ....lol <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/redface.gif">

Maybe it was a little abrasive, but it was just my opinion, <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif"> there's only one point I'd like to take up and that's with Doc Cyber.....Please don't take this as a personal attack on your work, it was not intended as that.......I certainly was'nt trying to emulate your writing style either..........I have a lot of respect for your work, and the many hours you take to produce them , your work with the airbrush is mind blowing.

Abrasive is good <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif"> , it draws out the true nature of people , I've learn't a few more things about certain members of this forum <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">

My "life" like so many others is filled with Photoshop and what I can produce with it, I'm only a year down the line, and far from happy with what I can achieve with it, I'm a perfectionist, and my goals are set high.

Peace and Good happiness stuff <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">

Here's the point r@m:
everytime you spout off some abrasive comments, someone responds with an opposing strong opinion, and then you go into your "isn't this a discussion froum?" bit. Yes, this is a discussion forum. and if you lead in with strong abrasive comments, you are going to get some back <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif"> I don't take anything personally, how about you take your own advice <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif"> and we can call it day huh?

r@m after reading your post thru a few times i started seeing more of what the content was. Seems you have a distaste for companies trying to make it easier for non artist to do the work of pros...And you might be right......but im constantly fighting the negative elements in the custom paint field and was probably looking at your post the wrong way.........i like abrasive when it constructive , but sometimes we have to set the stage before an abrasive post can be read with the authors intentions.....your post came out of left field to those who dont know you........so i hear what your sayin..but once again digital art isnt an exclusive club and all should be able to enjoy the power of computers and software even if that means leaning on plug-ins to creat what other wise would be tough for some.....i know there are effects that can be done in KPT that cant be done in PS .at least not in a time frame that is exceptable to a pating job.....so plug-ins do have a place in the pro arena .......I think this BBoard is one of the better ones out there as all seem to be on the same page.....i hope it continues..............DocCyber

Case in point...the time it took to post the last post get my kids of to the school bus i was also able to produce this using PS-KPT and Eye candy................thats quick enough for me especially when i have a deadline to meet..........and i dont think the effects are visable as cheap plug-in tools...............i also believe that a picture speaks a thousand words and you should always back up an opinionated post with substance.............DocCyber

dl-44:

no, here's the point you seem to keep missing.

r@m posts an 'abrasive' comment in GENERAL. "blah blah, filters suck, blah blah."

then everyone retorts, "well YOU suck r@m."

sheesh, r@m was just talking about how filters and they companies that make them aren't his favorite in the world, that's constructive enough for me. people bitching at r@m, on the other hand, aren't worth a damn constructively.


of course you didn't take his comment personally, because it wasn't directed at you or anyone else on this board. dur....

cheers.mikey.milker

Ok.....milkey. I'm referring to repeated incidents of the same person getting up in arms every time somebody comes back at him with comments as strong as his were.

And of course, r@m did essentailly insult anybody who opts to use 3rd party filters...so it was not just "in general"

Not to mention, nobody said r@m sucks.....?!?
or anthing close to it.
thanks for listening <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">



[This message has been edited by DL-44 (edited 15-06-2000).]

Filters are filters and it isn't any big deal who uses what to obtain a desired effect so long as it's done in good taste imho. After all, if you want absolute purity in art and design then you go back to pastels, charcoal, watercolors, or oils, correct?

As for bringing out the true nature of people, I say back atcha! I was merely mirroring your own hositilty to such mundane subjects.

And now for the news..........

Your honor in the case of 2winspapa vs. r@m, we the people, believe we have proven beyond the preponderance of the evidence that r@m as indicated by his own actions, needs to maintain some semblance of a normal, peace filled life, and all good things associated with such a life, so as not to have cause to assault any person or persons, for any reason or reasons whatsoever, in any place or forum, and in this asylum in particular.

Therefore 2winspapa has agreed to drop all charges against r@m in hopes that r@m can get on with his life and make a full recovery toward *true* peace and happiness.

peace



[This message has been edited by 2winspapa (edited 15-06-2000).]

damn... well since some people are just never going to see where i'm coming from. oi.

who'd have ever figured a topic "plugins" could be this much fun? hahahaha....

well i feel no ill will towards anyone, and i'm pretty sure everyone else feels the same way... so i second 2winspapa's notion to let everything drop between EVERYONE. this is a dead topic.. let's just leave it at that.

cheers.mikey.milker

p.s. hey dum-44, learn what a person's name is before you respond to it.. it's really annoying when people perpetually fuck up your name, cheers!

Sure thing milkey <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">
(in case you can't figure it out...which obviously you can't....it's a long name, so I combined the two parts. glad to see you guys are sticking to the "don't take things personally" philosophy you seem to talk about so much)

Now.....anybody esle have anything to add so we can get it over with and end this stupid fucking thread??



[This message has been edited by DL-44 (edited 15-06-2000).]

My comments were totally misunderstood by most people,
Most of my points were ignored..
I never attacked anyone personaly.........
I responded to a one liner that i did'nt understand , because i don't recieve USA tv channels.......
In that response I regretably used a flippant remark concerning Doc Cyber, I apologise for any offence that comment caused.
If you want substance , click on my profileand visit my homepage. or check out my Interface draft thread in the "post your work here thread"

Dull 44...repeated incidents?..err once., you do like to try to stir things up dontcha?

I have no I'll feelings towards anyone either , but to be honest I'm slightly hurt by 2wins giving the impression that he doesn't know me, even after many sessions on ICQ, I take it the next time you message me requesting help with PS, you'll remember my name?

[This message has been edited by r@m (edited 15-06-2000).]

Hey r@m....

You literally attacked me when you had all of the resources (icq and email) to clear this up....although I didn' realize I had to defend myself against you of all people.

I did defend the use of filters for anyone who desires to use them. To blast folks for using them is like calling someone an idiot for driving a car instead of using a horse!

We are all free to do as we please and see fit so long no one else gets hurt.

I was offended by your attack, and believe me anyone walking into this territory better not take it lightly, because I can yield a pen mightier than the sword. You should know that too.

If things are tough for you, man, I'm sorry, but please don't take it out on your friends. As for photoshop....I accepted your help on your technique. I won't ask you for anything else. Ever.

and now for the news........

How 'bout them Lakers?

stir things up???

after everyone is ready to leave this thread alone, you continue to talk shit.

Though everyone makes the mistake of judging one another, I think it is done way to much here. Let's not think that we all know each other so well. From reactions, to personal intrests, and dislikes etc. Yes we chat it up here, and in time we may learn these things about each other. But we cannot make harsh judgements of people and expect them to go along with it. I think we all need to *think* before we write. I am not saying baby anyone, but use common sense.

The idea of this forum is to *learn*. When unnecessary threads start it pulls us away from this idea. People enjoy conflict, I am sure the most of us go directly to this thread (or any with an argument) to see what punches have been thrown today. We are all hurt by that in one way or another. There are questions sitting out there waiting to be answered, yet this seems to be the most popular hangout. I cannot understand that.

The bottom line is forget about this thread or any other thread containing an argument, and get back to the point of the forum.

good point....no sense keeping this thread going....sorry nevex....let's start a new one...this one isn't going anywhere