Preserved Topic: Plug-ins

There was a good lively discussion on 3rd party plug-ins in the general forum..well id like to carry on this conversation here in the photoshop forum......are 3rd party plug-ins that bad and should we rely solely on photoshop plug-ins.........and what is the true reasons for plug-ins..myself i never really thought about wether or not they where good or bad untill that discussion

any one want to shed some more light on the subject

myself i love the power of KPT and eyecandy...anyone else use these filters with great success.......and if so what are your favorites

mine has to be the shadow effects in eyecandy as well as the glow filter....and in KPT i use the texture filter and frax flame every day........

anyone else...this is purly a fact finding mission not a pro-con although id like ta hear intelligent pro-con views

[This message has been edited by DocCyber (edited 15-06-2000).]

Doc..i never said plug-ins were bad,one of the things i stated was designs produced with 3rd party plug-ins, look like designs produced with 3rd party plug-ins..
If you want to learn the program fully and understand the mechanics of what you are creating, it's best to leave the plug-ins behind.
If your happy with what you can produce with them , or the time it saves you, great. )
Personally i rarely use them, i get more satisfaction achieving results, which i am unable to achieve using plug-ins.
I'ts a very subjective topic, i'm a perfectionist, close isn't good enough...it has to look right, I can only achieve this by using and understanding the raw power of PS.
I am obsessed with the program, I can't learn fast enough, I soak up new influences and ideas everyday, what if i where to see an effect not producable with a plug-in, wait until someone makes one before i tried to reproduce it?
I look at an object and break it down piece by piece layer by layer , then reconstruct it in my mind, fire up PS and sweat for a few hours to achieve the effect, for me plug-ins take away to many options,
This is just my opinion.



[This message has been edited by r@m (edited 15-06-2000).]

I guess i was a bit confussed when you said 3rd party plugins could never match the same quality as an effect done in PS. And it was there you peaked my curiosity. I never thought about it that way and had to ask myself is this true and can i achieve a better look in PS.....i have to admit i find it the true in some instance and not in others.......i guess it depends on your style.....most of my glass work is done in bryce then imported in PS............i respect your decision on burning the light of imagination and tearin down the process........and you might be right....you did open my eyes to something that might be valid........i have alredy learned some good tricks here using channels..........i would keep the discusion open but maybe approach the subjects in a more neutral light.............we all want to produce a certain zeal to our beliefs..we just have to learn to be more diplomatic so others can say....hmmmm maybe that is true instead of raising the gauntlets and letting loose a solvo of darts........just a thought...............would like ta hear what others have to say seeing as plug-ins are a major part of PS...............Cyber

Coincidentally, I happen to like the same plug-ins that you seem to like Doc, but for the past several months I've been trying to wean myself from them totally. In fact I rarely use the effects filters that come with PS 5.5 (drop shadow, bevel etc.).

I find I have greater control if I do the effect manually, and I can add those certain nuances that I believe seperate the casual user from the serious enthusiast. I am really beginning to appreciate Ozone's handson tutes as well as those on this forum.

I really never had the time to engross myself until recently.

Hi pals!
i'm a beginer user of Photoshop and in a short time i've discover that this program is really GREAT... but...i read about that "3rd party plug-ins" and want to know what is it?

Maybe some of you could sayme where i can get this kind of plug-ins..

Regards!


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Hay hombres que luchan un día y son muy buenos, hay hombres que luchan muchos años y son mejores....pero hay los que luchan tada la vida.... esos son los impresindibles!!
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Dr. Max Vector

Hey MaxVector! Cool siggie. We're talking about 3rd party filters like kai's power tools and alienskins eye candy etc.

They have customized filters that usually do a specific effect quickly and pretty well depending on your tastes.

2Wins pal, thanks about the sig. i made it for my company like a year ago.
By the way, these plug-ins are shareware or somethig ?? i am really interested...
Do you have someone ??
-Regards!

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Hay hombres que luchan un día y son muy buenos, hay hombres que luchan muchos años y son mejores....pero hay los que luchan tada la vida.... esos son los impresindibles!!
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Dr. Max Vector

I personally have never used any of the big 3rd party filters, because you have to buy them. I do have a slew of freeware ones, but they're generally useless unless you want to make psychedelic posters or something equally gaudy. Beyond that, I have no opinion except this -- whatever works for you <img border=0 align=absmiddle src="http://www.ozones.com/forum/smile.gif">

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that KPT was recently bought by Corel which is on the verge of going under, and EyeCandy is by AlienSkin, and you can probably order them online.

Do a search for photoshop plug-ins on the net search engines (heheh) that oughta keeep ya busy for awhile cevato!

If anyone is interested, alien skin has a demo download for eyecandy at http://www.alienskin.com/eyecandy/ec_demo.html. I think that the save feature is disabled though. See if you like it....

[This message has been edited by timothymcnulty (edited 16-06-2000).]

Im deffinatly against 3rd Party Plugins because I think they're a waste of time. They can give you nifty effects which seem cool, but like r@m said, you can always tell the 3rd Party Plugin art. They give you quick cheesie results that make you think your learning when your really not. I guess for a beginner it could help you to learn the interface of Photoshop a little bit better but Im a firm believer that you should learn how to do things manually, at least when it comes to digital art. DiVinci has an interesting article in his site about plugins I think people should read but I cant find the link for it. Ill post it if I find it.

Jestah
Jestah91@aol.com
ICQ - 77252449

I'm not *against* the use of 3rd party filters, I just don't use them much myself. One of the biggest risk is that they can make you lazy, especially in the beginning when you're supposed to be learning your tools. It can be ral tempting to just stay at the default settings for most of the major filters, you will get cool effects. The danger is that zillions of others will be getting the exact same cool effects, and your work will have no personality.

DocCyber, you're in no danger here, you've got a vision in your head, based off of years of experience, and you'll use those filters for purposes other than they might have intended at the start, or you'll do so many other things to your images, your personality will shine through.

Most all of my tutes show (in almost boring detail) how to get the cool effects using the basic filters because THAT'S HOW YOU LEARN. You don't want to simply explore the obvious features of your tools, you gotta dig, and hopefully make mistakes, that's where you discover new, cool effects that give your stuff an edge.

Already got an edge? Use whatever tool there is, you won't go wrong. My main problem with the big name filters is they make it easy to be lazy, and you never really learn to use the tools to their max. You gotta know the rules if you wanna break them! (And break them right! Breaking the rules becuase you're not even aware of them will make for an amateurish production, usually.)

Your pal, -doc-<P>

An artist shouldn't limit him/herself to using just the tools that come with his/her art kit. A third-party plug-in is just another tool in another package. Use it or don't, but don't look down on works done using them. That's elitist. Sure, a lot of people use them just to be lazy, but a good designer will work beyond what the filter does and use it to his/her advantage.

Heck, all filters do are create effects you can easily create with nothing but the different types of brushes and tools in Photoshop. You can add noise by stipling with a tiny brush. You can do lighting effects with a selection and an airbrush. Don't be biased against a work just because you can recognize a third-party plug-in used in its creation. If you use filters, you're just as lazy as they are.

I think this discusion has opened my eyes to a deeper sense of what the whole atmosphere here is about. And you all have changed my mind on 3rd party plug-ins. I still use them alot as some filters you cant replicate in photo-shop but i think those who spoke out against the filters are right. Doing it the PS way gives you a style that is individual. I admit i can see the end from the beginning and most of my filter work is a small part of the vision but good debate and some great points have been raised even those who fall into the camp where ..hey use every tool in the tool box cause you never know when you will need them....thanks for the discusion

I'd just like to say that third party plugins arent that great at all, but at first they may seem cool. When you first start it up, you get some cool effects and tweak around with em, but keep in mind that a LOT of people are using these kind of plugins and generic effects. This destroys the originality of the work and after a while it just looks bland. For example, I see a lot of bevels and fire using eyecandy. So use them sparingly, only to assist you in creating your grafix, but never rely on them. Just my 2 cents.