Preserved Topic: Astral Projection... (cringe)

original thread: http://www.ozoneasylum.com/Forum17/HTML/000202.html
--------------------------------------------
follow up thread: http://www.ozoneasylum.com/Forum17/HTML/000206.html
--------------------

if you've read the other threads you know why i cringe, but i still feel this is a worthy topic and there are a lot of different views on it. let's try to keep it objective.

i'm starting this thread up again because i hope to learn as much as i can on the topic and i still have the goal of eventually being able to astrally project myself. the astral plane sounds like an adventure waiting to happen; dangers, mystery, invisibility, instantaneous travel, personal exploration, flying, dreaming, ... the mysteries of the mind. it is all so fascinating and yet largely unexplored by the majority of the populous. i hope to better understand it myself and help anyone with what little i do know of it. i feel there is much to be gained by learning about your subconcious and your spirit.

so far we have discussed the nature of the spirit and it's relationship to the body, opinions on if it should even be experimented with, some of the history of astral projection, and some of the fundamentals of our psyche. there's been questions of it really being possible or if it's bogus, and topics brought up such as the actual makup of souls and the purpose of them. re****y and perception, enhancers and strengths. the list goes on, these are just some of the points.

so, looking for opinions, looking for beneficial information to help with my personal studies on the topic, and looking for intelligent answers. thank you to all who would enlighten me.

~Sir_KiTree~Scan~
--:ill communications network:--

Mi opinion is this : If you are *seriously* interested in learning all you can, with the intention of using and/or creating in the astral (if we must use that word), then here is probably not the place to find what you need.

alt.magick (lurk b4 you leap)

And a search for these names will give you more than enuf to begin with :
Austin Osman Spare, Aliester Crowley, Peter Carroll and Don Kraig. The latter two being more modern in thier approach.

anyways, hope that helps =)

Weadz (i know nozink, nozink!)

Hmm, I was once a very dedicated student of the works of Crowley. I came at it from the stance of a sceptic, one I feel that Aleister would have approved of, he used to *love* pouring bullshit into willing ears, simply because they accepted it. (You have to be in the know to get the humour of it, kind of like the work of certain comics today, heh.) The best and brightest nugget I salvaged from all of my research was "Love is the law, love under will." The concept of "will" shows up more and more the deeper you dig into this, I'm reminded of "the pow-pow-power of positive thinking!" Truly, in order to succeed in any goal, you must have the will to travel the road required. Some of the early Magick excercises were a bit out there, as in - pick a word, and now don't think of it. Jab yourself with a [knife/needle other sharp object] every time you do! I would not recommend this for anyone, ouch! Still, training the will can give you intense power over your life.

BTW, "reality" is re-instated, it's got it's uses, especially in this forum!

Your pal, -doc-

Hmm, I agree that skepticism is the key to understanding. But not just skepticism towards NEW ideas. Skepticism towards EVERYTHING. Especially what you think you know, because as I've said again and again, human knowledge is ridiculously fragile and based in assumptions which are by no means infallible.

Weadah may be right that there are better places to go to discuss this kind of topic. I never have had much interest in being a part of new agey kind of social groups, because I get the feeling that half the people are just looking for anything to believe, and the other half are totally detached from reality. I only share my views here because it seems like a good place for the free exchange of ideas, but in the real world I prefer stay focused on physical matters for the most part.

-jiblet

Action consists of uniting a doer with the thing that is being done. Love is this union, and law is what governs action. This definition is necessarily all-encompassing, but the whole point is to exclude any other purpose or reasoning other than union for its own sake.

Consider 'I am divided for love's sake, for the chance of union.'

And why put love under will? So you can control said actions, on a practical day-to-day basis, and because will describes the pattern of these actions, on a theoretical basis.

Every act should then become a willed act, dedicated to fulfillment of the will.

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law. Love is the law, love under will.
One of Crowleys more useful insights, and even so you need to see thru the blind.

What does that have to do with astral projection? Nothing, until you apply one to the other.

Weadz =)

[This message has been edited by Weadah (edited 07-11-2001).]

And so came the first line of the Wiccan Rede...a druidic pass down that is a mingling of goddess worship, and self empowerment through metaphysical equality:
"An let it harm none, love, and do as thou wilt."

Wow..so simple.

Astral projection.....can you exist away from the flesh? Well that's personal insight, no? A world of "majick" means that the expression of energy between yourself and your surroundings is increased.....so if you project, then it's all about you...


So...why ask?

~grin~

If anyone here can Astral Project themselves real well, let him come over here then. I have tea and cookies ready, kay?

Love is not only the law, it is also an emotion.. and like all emotions, it is not necessarily rational, reasonable or logical.. I'm not sure how 'will' fits in there... Are you saying we can will ourselves to love?

No.

Tho everything is permissible.

Heh.

Didn't Richard Bach talk about his experiences with Astral Projection along with his wife, Leslie Parrish, in 'The Bridge Across Forever' and 'One'?

Nice books, btw


Me. Loony. 'nuff said.

velvetrose,

Love is most certainly and absolutely *NOT* a feeling. Can we will ourselves to love? That is the *only* possible way to love.

The Greeks had umpteen different words for the one word we have in English for "love". It is no wonder there is much disagreement and confusion on what "love" is in our culture.

As scary as it is that I might have anything good to say about Crowley, if he did anything to remove "love" from the realm of the unrational feelings and place it in squarely in the realm of rational will, he did a good thing.

I think I'm gonna take a look at learning some Greek.
I seems like a cool, very precise and non-ambivalent language.

Dhromed, and what better way to learn than to study the early Xian manuscripts? Wouldn't that be cool?

Yes, from what little I do know about it, it was an excellent language. Nearly all the New Testament was written in Greek. There's even a Greek version of the Hebrew scriptures called the Septuagint.

hmm, i heard that the scriptures were translated into greek because it became the dominant language and the younger hebrew children were learning greek but not the original
language(s) the books were in...

much as English has become the dominant language across the new world and hawaii too.. native languages begin to die as fewer people use them..

bugimus: we may not have all the words that the greek language does for love, but we do have translations for those words.. filial love, friendship, maternal love, and others...



[This message has been edited by velvetrose (edited 07-16-2001).]