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WebShaman Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Happy Hunting Grounds... Insane since: Mar 2001	posted 01-15-2005 12:41 Since both Gideon and Ram seem to want to "push" this thing further, in a personal sense, I suggest to you both to take it to e-mail!. I already posted my position on things. Accept it or leave it as you will. I'm not interested in attempting to "answer" your points here. It serves no useful point, as this thread has proven. This is the last time that I will explain myself to you both. You both are responsible for your actions, irregardless of what you may think to the contrary. And those who are reacting to your posts (including me) were attempting to show you something. It is your choice if you wish to ignore it. To Ram - I never, ever expected you to "change your postion". Nor did I ever suggest that you do. It is stuff like this that keeps getting you into the losing end of such debates. You assume something, and run out and post such - it is just ludicrous. All I ever expected from you, is to learn how to present your opinion, point WITHOUT putting things in that are not true! This thread (and a horde of others) are FULL of such - and you have a very hard time admitting to wrongdoing, or that you are faulty - much like Bush, in that regards. That is the last thing I am going to explain to you. Take it or leave it as you will. To Gideon - why does such happen to you and Ram repeatedly? And why is it, that it is not happening to other members? Well, let me see - is it really the "minority view", as Ram suggests? NO. It has nothing to do with that. Many here at the Asylum (as I said before - you sure you actually read what I posted?) have differeing viewpoints on things. All manner of things, actually. It is how information is presented, that makes the difference. Examine what others post, how they post it - and compare it with how you post it. I think you will soon see the differences. Now, I'm not suggesting that you "copy" others - far from it. I'm suggesting that you examine why you and Ram seem to keep getting into threads like this. You want the answer? I have given you a way to find it - the work you will have to do yourself. I personally find it sad, that things had to come to this, before you both were "ready" for a dialog. Had you both been willing to listen earlier, it would have never come to this. Ram still doesn't seem to be listening - I don't really think he wants to. But you Gideon, may. Again, this is the last time I will explain myself to you. You both are responsible, for how this board sees you. Make of that what you will.
Xpirex Paranoid (IV) Inmate From: Still looking.. Insane since: Mar 2003	posted 01-15-2005 15:37 There's gonna be a lot of 'Eating one's words' finally.. Wonderful. QUOTATION: "If you're too open minded, your brains will fall out."
Jestah Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Long Island, NY Insane since: Jun 2000	posted 01-15-2005 16:35 quote: That is true. But maybe it was wishful thinking? Maybe Cheney was just hoping that there were some there to prove his point. I don't really know what was going on in his head, but I personally think they should have chosen a different reason for war. I feel confident that the Bush Administration had no hard proof of WMD in Iraq. They wanted to go to war with the country for political reasons, knew the liberation angle would never fly with the world, and invented WMD. I think the worse part of it is you can't even get this Administration to admit they made a mistake.
Gideon Bipolar (III) Inmate From: rooted on planet Mars, I mean Earth Insane since: May 2004	posted 01-17-2005 05:40 quote: Jestah said: I feel confident that the Bush Administration had no hard proof of WMD in Iraq. That is a very plausible event. I guess with my wishful, optimistic, believe there is good in everyone attitude (man I wish I had more of that), I try to trust people. That might eventually be my undoing, but I try and give people the benefit of the doubt. I have heard many things about Bush's character, many of which I like. They could have just been campaign devices made to sway my thinking, but I hope for the best. If it really did happen as you say, then Bush just got lowered many notches on my trust scale. (I'm just glad this will be over with and fresh blood will be in the office in 4 years, these smear campaigns are getting redundant.) quote: Xpirex said: QUOTATION: "If you're too open minded, your brains will fall out." quote: WebShaman said: you sure you actually read what I posted? I do read what you post. I guess I sometimes may not be able to grasp somethings you say because of the way my brain works (very selective brain, I think it needs a tune-up). But if I ever misunderstand please forgive me, and correct me as soon as possible. About minority I think that it is a little of both. There is no doubt there are other Christians, self-proclaimed or God-ordained, that post on this forum. There are some that read but do not post and that is fine also. There are also Some Athiests, Agnostics, Pluralists, Muslum, Buddist, etc. even some I think there is no word to describe. There is no doubt on the amount of vairiety of fatih practices in Ozone. The thing is that it is quite easy to single out one group. You can say that, yes, there are many groups, but God-ordained Christians are just one of many groups. If those other groups decide to attack the one group of Christians you go from having many minorities to having one minority, one majority, and few straglers. I think that is the thought that Ram. touched on. quote: WebShaman said: It is how information is presented, that makes the difference. Examine what others post, how they post it - and compare it with how you post it. I think you will soon see the differences. Now, I'm not suggesting that you "copy" others - far from it. I'm suggesting that you examine why you and Ram seem to keep getting into threads like this. I think it may be that we don't copy others. I confess that I LOVE to speak about my Savior. That is something I do. I go to a thread and sometimes I get insults for that love. I completely understand, I used to do it to Christians all the time before I was born into God's family. It could stem from guilt, it could stem from past experiences and anger, I don't know. But what I do know is that I can be insulted a lot, and still love my God and my people (the human race). It is something the Holy Spirit has been working with me on. I think it is neat. I'm not going to copy others because some people are walking off cliffs. I chose my own path. I chose to walk God's path that He made for me. I have many reasons, most of them plausible, for why I post the way I do. Feel free to ask me anytime why I do the things I do. I will be happy to tell you why. quote: WebShaman said: Had you both been willing to listen earlier, it would have never come to this. I am willing to listen. I am not willing to compromise my beliefs to conform to others, but I will at least listen to their arguments. If the argument is posted I will think about it. If the argument is good it might change how I feel about things. If it is really good I might use it else where (mimicery is the highest form of flattery, remember that). I will not, however, compromise my love for Jesus. That will always stay there. quote: WebShaman said: I suggest to you both to take it to e-mail!. I already commented on this once WS. I gave my reasons. If you can prove me otherwise, I might change my mind. quote: WebShaman said: And those who are reacting to your posts (including me) were attempting to show you something. It is your choice if you wish to ignore it. That is correct. I love it when people point out my faults, because that allows me to become stronger and better. Even in insults I can do that. I'd rather it was constructive criticism, but I take them as I get 'em. I do decide to not adhere to some of the posted criticism, because really I can't do it all. I do have to just brush off some things. Do not mistake that as not reading them. I do read them AND comprehend them before I brush them off. Do not rebuke a mocker or he will hate you, rebuke a wise man and he will love you.
Sangreal Bipolar (III) Inmate From: the league of Professional Mop Jockeys Insane since: Apr 2004	posted 01-27-2005 15:22 Quote:You forgot the epidsode where Bush claimed Saddam intended to buy some uranium in africa while he already knew this information was bogus. where BUSH CLAIMED SADDAM INTENDED to buy some uranium in Africa. Keywords in this sentence are capitalized. BUSH- as already stated has a habit of untruths. CLAIMED SADDAM- Anybody can claim Saddam (or anybody else) is going to do something, this doesn't mean we should go to war. And personally I don't think we need a President that can't figure out a good concrete reason to go to war. INTENDED- people can have lots of intentions. If i had the intention of giving an orphanage $300 million dollars does that mean you automatically put me up for an award before i donate the money? What if i have Good intentions but end up blowing up the orphanage some how? Does that make it ok? Theres alot of things that are wrong with intentions and claiming the intentions of other human beings. Especiallly since you cannot successfully predict human behavior ever 66% of the time. History is nothing but a fable that has been agreed upon. -Napolean Bonaparte

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WebShaman
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

posted 01-15-2005 12:41

Since both Gideon and Ram seem to want to "push" this thing further, in a personal sense, I suggest to you both to take it to e-mail!.
I already posted my position on things. Accept it or leave it as you will.

I'm not interested in attempting to "answer" your points here. It serves no useful point, as this thread has proven. This is the last time that I will explain myself to you both. You both are responsible for your actions, irregardless of what you may think to the contrary. And those who are reacting to your posts (including me) were attempting to show you something. It is your choice if you wish to ignore it.

To Ram - I never, ever expected you to "change your postion". Nor did I ever suggest that you do. It is stuff like this that keeps getting you into the losing end of such debates. You assume something, and run out and post such - it is just ludicrous. All I ever expected from you, is to learn how to present your opinion, point WITHOUT putting things in that are not true! This thread (and a horde of others) are FULL of such - and you have a very hard time admitting to wrongdoing, or that you are faulty - much like Bush, in that regards. That is the last thing I am going to explain to you. Take it or leave it as you will.

To Gideon - why does such happen to you and Ram repeatedly? And why is it, that it is not happening to other members? Well, let me see - is it really the "minority view", as Ram suggests? NO. It has nothing to do with that. Many here at the Asylum (as I said before - you sure you actually read what I posted?) have differeing viewpoints on things. All manner of things, actually. It is how information is presented, that makes the difference. Examine what others post, how they post it - and compare it with how you post it. I think you will soon see the differences. Now, I'm not suggesting that you "copy" others - far from it. I'm suggesting that you examine why you and Ram seem to keep getting into threads like this. You want the answer? I have given you a way to find it - the work you will have to do yourself.

I personally find it sad, that things had to come to this, before you both were "ready" for a dialog. Had you both been willing to listen earlier, it would have never come to this. Ram still doesn't seem to be listening - I don't really think he wants to. But you Gideon, may. Again, this is the last time I will explain myself to you.

You both are responsible, for how this board sees you. Make of that what you will.

Xpirex
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Still looking..
Insane since: Mar 2003

posted 01-15-2005 15:37

There's gonna be a lot of 'Eating one's words' finally.. Wonderful.

QUOTATION: "If you're too open minded, your brains will fall out."

Jestah
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Long Island, NY
Insane since: Jun 2000

posted 01-15-2005 16:35

quote:
That is true. But maybe it was wishful thinking? Maybe Cheney was just hoping that there were some there to prove his point. I don't really know what was going on in his head, but I personally think they should have chosen a different reason for war.

I feel confident that the Bush Administration had no hard proof of WMD in Iraq. They wanted to go to war with the country for political reasons, knew the liberation angle would never fly with the world, and invented WMD. I think the worse part of it is you can't even get this Administration to admit they made a mistake.

Gideon
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: rooted on planet Mars, *I mean Earth*
Insane since: May 2004

posted 01-17-2005 05:40

quote:
Jestah said:

I feel confident that the Bush Administration had no hard proof of WMD in Iraq.

That is a very plausible event. I guess with my wishful, optimistic, believe there is good in everyone attitude (man I wish I had more of that), I try to trust people. That might eventually be my undoing, but I try and give people the benefit of the doubt.

I have heard many things about Bush's character, many of which I like. They could have just been campaign devices made to sway my thinking, but I hope for the best. If it really did happen as you say, then Bush just got lowered many notches on my trust scale. (I'm just glad this will be over with and fresh blood will be in the office in 4 years, these smear campaigns are getting redundant.)

quote:
Xpirex said:

QUOTATION: "If you're too open minded, your brains will fall out."

quote:
WebShaman said:

you sure you actually read what I posted?

I do read what you post. I guess I sometimes may not be able to grasp somethings you say because of the way my brain works (very selective brain, I think it needs a tune-up). But if I ever misunderstand please forgive me, and correct me as soon as possible.

About minority I think that it is a little of both. There is no doubt there are other Christians, self-proclaimed or God-ordained, that post on this forum. There are some that read but do not post and that is fine also. There are also Some Athiests, Agnostics, Pluralists, Muslum, Buddist, etc. even some I think there is no word to describe. There is no doubt on the amount of vairiety of fatih practices in Ozone. The thing is that it is quite easy to single out one group. You can say that, yes, there are many groups, but God-ordained Christians are just one of many groups. If those other groups decide to attack the one group of Christians you go from having many minorities to having one minority, one majority, and few straglers. I think that is the thought that Ram. touched on.

quote:
WebShaman said:

It is how information is presented, that makes the difference. Examine what
others post, how they post it - and compare it with how you post it. I think you
will soon see the differences. Now, I'm not suggesting that you "copy" others -
far from it. I'm suggesting that you examine why you and Ram seem to keep
getting into threads like this.

I think it may be that we don't copy others. I confess that I LOVE to speak about my Savior. That is something I do. I go to a thread and sometimes I get insults for that love. I completely understand, I used to do it to Christians all the time before I was born into God's family. It could stem from guilt, it could stem from past experiences and anger, I don't know. But what I do know is that I can be insulted a lot, and still love my God and my people (the human race). It is something the Holy Spirit has been working with me on. I think it is neat.

I'm not going to copy others because some people are walking off cliffs. I chose my own path. I chose to walk God's path that He made for me. I have many reasons, most of them plausible, for why I post the way I do. Feel free to ask me anytime why I do the things I do. I will be happy to tell you why.

quote:
WebShaman said:

Had you both been willing to listen earlier, it would have never come to this.

I am willing to listen. I am not willing to compromise my beliefs to conform to others, but I will at least listen to their arguments. If the argument is posted I will think about it. If the argument is good it might change how I feel about things. If it is really good I might use it else where (mimicery is the highest form of flattery, remember that). I will not, however, compromise my love for Jesus. That will always stay there.

quote:
WebShaman said:

I suggest to you both to take it to e-mail!.

I already commented on this once WS. I gave my reasons. If you can prove me otherwise, I might change my mind.

quote:
WebShaman said:

And those who are reacting to your posts (including me) were attempting to show
you something. It is your choice if you wish to ignore it.

That is correct. I love it when people point out my faults, because that allows me to become stronger and better. Even in insults I can do that. I'd rather it was constructive criticism, but I take them as I get 'em. I do decide to not adhere to some of the posted criticism, because really I can't do it all. I do have to just brush off some things. Do not mistake that as not reading them. I do read them AND comprehend them before I brush them off.

Do not rebuke a mocker or he will hate you, rebuke a wise man and he will love you.

Sangreal
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: the league of Professional Mop Jockeys
Insane since: Apr 2004

posted 01-27-2005 15:22

Quote:You forgot the epidsode where Bush claimed Saddam intended to buy some uranium in africa while he already knew this information was bogus.

where BUSH CLAIMED SADDAM INTENDED to buy some uranium in Africa.
Keywords in this sentence are capitalized. BUSH- as already stated has a habit of untruths.

CLAIMED SADDAM- Anybody can claim Saddam (or anybody else) is going to do something, this doesn't mean we should go to war. And personally I don't think we need a President that can't figure out a good concrete reason to go to war.

INTENDED- people can have lots of intentions. If i had the intention of giving an orphanage $300 million dollars does that mean you automatically put me up for an award before i donate the money? What if i have Good intentions but end up blowing up the orphanage some how? Does that make it ok? Theres alot of things that are wrong with intentions and claiming the intentions of other human beings. Especiallly since you cannot successfully predict human behavior ever 66% of the time.

History is nothing but a fable that has been agreed upon.
-Napolean Bonaparte