Topic: Lucifer? (A bit of philosophy/A bit of Silliness)

Hum

There are many theories and theorist, Miguel Serrano being one of those, who claim that Lucifer is mistakenly identified in translations of the bible.
Perhaps the bible is all about succumbing to an evil power and ignoring our true human power, thus succumbing to a powerfully evil and destructive God who wants to rule us and fears what we can become. This God wants us to ignore our individual Godly powers, and bow down to his submissive wishes of control. For instance, the Tower of Babel. God fears that humans could become as powerful as he is. Perhaps Jesus was actually an opponent of God, and was trying to get us all to realize that we need to strive to find the God Power inside of ourselves, and go against the submissive teachings of the old testament.

Perhaps God is evil and is trying to control the human race for his/her/its greedy reasons?
Perhaps Jesus' true teachings have been suppressed to help blend the Old and New Testaments into one?

Here is the best source of on-line religious texts: Sacred Texts
Another really good place: Early Christian Writings

Interesting books: Infancy Gospel of Thomas | The Gospel of Nicodemus | The Book of Enoch

Anyway. Just thought I would put this out there...

----| Asylum Quotes

(Edited by Gilbert Nolander on 02-26-2008 06:04)

Wait... is this Gnosticism?


___________________________
Suho: www.liminality.org | Cell 270 | Sig Rotator | the Fellowship of Sup

I personally find the idea of one Being being the personification of all that is bad and horrible in existence to be beyond belief.

But that is just me.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

Suho - definitely fits with most gnostic systems.

As for the content - ~shrug~ nothing new. Gnosticism was one of the heavy hitters of christian belief in the early days...and continued in at least a secondary role throughout much of the early middle ages.

It is an interesting field of study historically speaking, if not philosophically.

So, then: What do you guys think about the questions I posed...

Perhaps God is evil and is trying to control the human race for his/her/its greedy reasons?
Perhaps Jesus' true teachings have been suppressed to help blend the Old and New Testaments into one?

Do you think that perhaps Christians are being decieved? I would like a Christian perspective on this, if anyone wishes to offer one.

I can't offer a christian perspective, but I can offer an educated one.

quote:

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Gilbert Nolander said:

Perhaps God is evil and is trying to control the human race for his/her/its greedy reasons?

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Since there is no god(s), I really can't offer anything on that one...
It's like asking me if I think the Easter Bunny has honorable intentions or not.

quote:

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Gilbert Nolander said:
Perhaps Jesus' true teachings have been suppressed to help blend the Old and New Testaments into one?Do you think that perhaps Christians are being decieved?

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There is no question that the teachings of Jesus have been very highly manipulated, and many writings that have as good a chance, or better, of being somewhat authentic have been suppressed for very many centuries.

His "true" teachings? Who can say... The scriptures we have were written so long after the fact, there is no evidence that can possibly hint at what level of connection they have to the actual person, if any at all.

(Edited by DL-44 on 03-17-2008 13:51)

Nice post, DL.

To add to it, examination of the writings in the New Testament using advanced scientific methods of comparing speech patterns and writing patterns, most of the New Testament has certainly either been translated differently or manipulated in some form or manner from that which is attributed to Jesus.

So either those that added the texts made it up, or heard it from word of mouth (and we all know how garbled something becomes when one does this - just sit 5 people in a row, and whisper a sentence from one to the other, and see what comes out), or came from other sources not accredited in the Bible itself.

Also, the fact that the Bible was put together by a council centuries after Jesus was dead and certainly did not include all the material that it could have (as DL pointed out), one needs to really look at the motives of these people and groups - why did they select what they did, and leave other sources out? Setting aside the "it was God's Will" answer (which is not an answer at all), one really has to look at the players at the time, and research the events that were going on.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

Agreed. We are dealing with the intentions of the author(s) not a god or god(s). To attribute the authors interpretations to god or any other figure is to perpetuate the chain of control granted to the author. I can write what I want attribute it to a God, get a following and be controlling or influencing the lives of many, many people if I choose. Providing my intentions are reasonable... who's to say that's a horrible thing? But after I'm gone and Charlie down the road interprets my writings a different way... well... he has his own built in army to go with what he wants to make it say. Religion, Tyranny with a pretty face. If you're looking to a book for truth you are following man... not god. I don't think god would be very happy with that.

GD

[Edit]To answer your questions specifically.

quote:

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Perhaps God is evil and is trying to control the human race for his/her/its greedy reasons?

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I think God is a prize dangled in front of the masses to illicite control. I know MAN is trying to control the masses through religion. If god(s) exist... we are ants in a social experiment with no purpose but to live and die. I plan to do both of those things well, regardless of god(s).

quote:

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Perhaps Jesus' true teachings have been suppressed to help blend the Old and New Testaments into one?

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Who knows? Of all religious entities Jesus is perhaps the best representation of a goal to aspire to that I have seen. Unfortunately, he is but a figurehead, a tool, for the juggernaut that is religion. To date, my definition of the anti-christ is the church.
[/Edit]

(Edited by GrythusDraconis on 03-17-2008 17:45)

Nothing (much) to do with this, but I remember my sister having a classmate named Lucy Fernandez...

Back on the subject, I find this theory is very interesting indeed... These days I have encountered the theory that God may be "evil and trying to control the human race for his/her/its greedy reasons" in more than one occasions, and it is starting to work its funny way in my head...
Nowadays I tend to think He may just be a businessman...

(Edited by kimson on 03-17-2008 19:02)

How about a conman?

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles