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argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 01:25 Edit Quote

This one is awesome. I'll start small : giving you my cube,
and the rule of part 1 of this game.

Only thing is : you can play this game once in a lifetime, subsequent attempts will fail.
So stop here if you want to keep the surprise for another time.

My cube is metallic, blue, floating above the ground. It is the size of a small house, vertical, and standing some 50 meters of me.

On to creating your cube :

quote:

"In the desert, imagine a cube. What does it look like? What is it
made of? Where is it located? What state is it in?"



This is something you should really "view" in your mind : post your cube if you dare, and I'll tell you
many things about you - just like my cube tells you many things about me. Beware : the cube doesn't lie.

Suho1004
Maniac (V) Mad Librarian

From: Seoul, Korea
Insane since: Apr 2002

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 04:13 Edit Quote

Hmm... sounds like fun. I'll give it a shot.

For starters, "desert" can mean a number of things. The desert I am imagining is in the American southwest: a dry, dusty desert with a modicum of flora (such as cacti and scrub) and some hardy fauna (lizards, snakes, some insects). There are a lot of rocks, and some striking rock formations in the distance.

My cube is a monolith of obsidian, and it's huge. I'm guessing it's at least a hundred meters in each dimension, possibly more. It is only by standing far away that I can appreciate how large it is. Up close it is just a massive, glassy black wall that rises up into the blue sky. The edges are sharp and defined. It sits flat, semi-buried in raised parts of the landscape, as if it is jutting straight out of the earth. And it might, for all I know.

There is a small opening in one side of the cube at ground level. It is big enough for me to enter standing. There is no light inside, and shining a light in is like pointing a flashlight into a black hole. I cannot see anything at all. I hesitate to go in, but my curiosity will eventually cancel out my apprehension, I suspect.

Analyze away.


___________________________
Suho: www.liminality.org | Cell 270 | Sig Rotator | the Fellowship of Sup

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 07:15 Edit Quote

Cool. Well, the cube represents your perception of yourself.
Usually, time should be allowed for end users to picture theirs.

This is a renounded psychology test : representations of a unitary object like a cube
are known to be, among humans, metaphors of the self.


Yours is immense - and that is how you value yourself, immensely. However, the fact it is burried suggests humility - the relation
to the ground, most often, represents our relationship to others (so well grounded you're deep in the sand). If I understand you correctly, the fact it is opaque
represents your desire to keep some things away from public eye - a discretion about some sides of your personality.

The fact you can ENTER it is completely new to me : it probably represents a desire to investigate your inner self further

In general, black or dark colors just seem to be a common trend among similarly well grounded personalities - but that's as much as I know.
Where does it stand? Is it near to you, further away?

Blaise
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: London
Insane since: Jun 2003

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 10:50 Edit Quote

Man, this is the oldest chat up line in the book! In fact, I've used it and it works

If you're really into it pick up the book you can get it for as little as 33p!

Argo wouldn't happen to be a PUA by any chance?

warjournal
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From:
Insane since: Aug 2000

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 11:33 Edit Quote

Desert like the one we visited in Mexico. Cracked ground. Largely flat, but horizon broken by hills and mountains. A cactus or two every so many dozen meters.

My cube is a real cube four inches on each side. Metallic cyan or baby blue. The edges and corners are rounded or chamfered nice and smooth. At every 1.33 inches there is a groove as if you can manipulate it like a Rubik's Cube, but it doesn't twist because it really is one solid piece. And it floats at chest height as if to invite grasping it. What happens when you actually grasp it is another story.

Have at it.

(Edited by warjournal on 02-29-2008 11:35)

WebShaman
Lunatic (VI) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 11:53 Edit Quote

My desert is on Mars. A magnificent, red landscapte, with long, elegant shadows that stretch off into the horizon.

My cube is small, and fits into the palm of my hand. I take it everywhere (I just slip it into my pocket). It is the color of deep Jade, verdant and brilliant.

I can place it anywhere, in the ground, in the air, on a shelf, in my pocket, etc. It is movable and has no sharp edges, they being rounded. The surface is smooth and warm to the touch, without hard edges.

My cube speaks to me, and I can converse with it.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

Suho1004
Maniac (V) Mad Librarian

From: Seoul, Korea
Insane since: Apr 2002

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 12:56 Edit Quote

Interesting. Sounds pretty accurate--at least, it sounds like the way I perceive myself.

quote:

argo navis said:

Where does it stand? Is it near to you, further away?



Well, that's the thing--I can see it at a distance and I can also see it close up. But it is always me that moves, either closer or further away. I can't imagine ever moving the cube.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 13:55 Edit Quote
quote:

it sounds like the way I perceive myself.



Yeah, exactly : everyone's cube is the way they perceive themselves. This is a wonderful cold reading/analysis technique,
but it also is a great way to exchange with others (and just plain fun and interesting).

Picturing a cube in a desert, in everyone's mind, for some reason, brings up...
yourself as you see it, and that works with everyone I have tested it with.
In addition, this technique dates from very old cultures, it's origins being unclear.

So there is a LOT more to it : the cube itself is just the first part of the game - relationships, ambitions, and much more, can be worked into the scene.

As for the distance : it usually represents how connected to yourself you do feel - how self aware you are.


Your moving camera could be one of two things - an ability to alter your self awareness, as in "seeing yourself from a distance of your choice",
or it may be a consequence of the "blurting out the questions as a block" : eg. once you have pictured ONE cube, since you know the trick,
the image belongs to your conscience - where you can manipulate it and alter the "revelation" it brings (so usually, bringing up the questions gradually
works best).

As for my cube : blue is often associated to "feeling blue", just a bit in my case (mine is more cyan than blue). The size and opacity, we discussed,
the distance as well, I often find myself looking at myself in "3rd person". And the floating ABOVE the ground reflects that giant ego of mine.
Something to work back INTO the ground.

...Now, I may as well progress into steps 2, 3, 4 and 5 of the story - if you can, though, try to picture your cube genuinely and post it, it's fun and a mind opener.



(Rules for Part II : bring up the desert/cube scene in your mind, and add a ladder to the scene - I'll come back with the questions)

(Edited by argo navis on 02-29-2008 13:57)

White Hawk
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: zero divided.
Insane since: May 2004

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 14:26 Edit Quote

Heehee - sorry, but I have to interject momentarily, only to point out that this thread is possibly the only one in which WebShaman will ever use the words 'deep' and 'Jade' in the same sentence... ...that just tickles me!

WebShaman
Lunatic (VI) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 15:09 Edit Quote

Well...I can think of another reason I might use those words together, but I do not want to appear unkind...

Hehe...

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 15:36 Edit Quote
quote:

Argo wouldn't happen to be a PUA by any chance?


You and me know that chance has nothing to do with it Find me at Mystery's current lair, as me.
Let's not talk about the fight club though, people have a hard time understanding when they haven't field tested.
But no surprise that I keep posting about NLP : business + sales + self improvement.. and you just realized?-)


WJ, Webshaman, uncommon cubes, they highly suggest - due to size - a small ego, whatever that means (I imagine it means a deep - as a deeply rooted belief - dedication to others, it certainly means
other things too). The green... I have to pick up the meaning of this colour in terms of perception, but it's relevant to some of your traits as well.

WS : The talking to cube - I am willing to bet you DO talk to yourself internally. The quality and opacity mean similar things as Suho's, WJ's or mine.
Rounded edges, to me, indicate a natural tendency to compromise instead of a harsher, more agressive self - I see peace in this cube.

WJ : your cube is very similar to mine, oddly enough Two things that stand out : COMPLEX, but SOLID and coherent.
Opaque always means "a desire to conceal" some things.

quote:

And it floats at chest height as if to invite grasping it. What happens when you actually grasp it is another story.



An invitation to reflexion - that is the purpose you attach to yourself. Floating above the ground like mine, your cube "feels" above other people,
but it explicitely invites them to "have a go"... and in both structure and your own words, it has a lot more to it than the invitation suggests, thus offering a challenge
really.

The fact that perspective varies for all of you, again, may come from improper delivery (too fast a list of questions for you to transition fully into the mental representation),
or very rich and flexible perceptions of the self, read my comments about Suho. I suspect the former, but it's no big deal.

As the game continues, I'll offer more insight into individual cases (have to gather some notes about it - namely, regarding the colors).



(Edited by argo navis on 02-29-2008 15:39)

WebShaman
Lunatic (VI) Mad Scientist

From: Happy Hunting Grounds...
Insane since: Mar 2001

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 16:14 Edit Quote
quote:
I am willing to bet you DO talk to yourself internally.



Ermm...doesn't everyone?

Come to think of it, I have never considered the possibility that others do not. It is as natural for me to do this as breathing.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 16:18 Edit Quote

I don't.

Every person have their own submodalities (elements of perception, ways to represent things internally).
I imagine things as pictures, mostly. Sounds sometimes or a combination - and I learn best using these vectors of perception.

In general, this tells me that you learn a lot based on words, and attach a heavy weight to those same words : you probably read quite a lot.
...


See how much the cube has to reveal? A lot more, even.
Thank you for sharing.

White Hawk
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: zero divided.
Insane since: May 2004

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 17:02 Edit Quote

Okay, I'm game...

My cube is a few feet across. It rotates slowly through each axis. It looks translucent, but bends light strongly. Rather than seeing through it, there are patterns and shapes vaguely visible - water, greenery, faces, buildings, and geometric designs - but the images are not static, and they change as the cube rotates. It's not like diamond - more like quartz or frosted glass, clouded and slightly rough to the touch. It looks as though it would drift if pushed in any direction - seemingly weightless, but with mass. The edges are not sharp. In fact, it looks hand-hewn.

Ooh, in fact, it looks a bit like ice, but it's not cold - rather, it's warmer than the surrounding plains. This is somewhere high, like a plateau in a mountainous region - the air is cold, but the clouds are thin.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 17:18 Edit Quote

A passionate (emotions rich), self made, and dynamic/creative perception of yourself.
Transparency : you want to invite people in your reality - you want them to see through you and are generally easy going and people oriented.
But you want them to see through only partly - and you'll feed them warm and colourful impressions.

...

You learn and memorize mostly through physical contact, and visual cues (more through physical contact). I am willing to bet that when buying something,
you need to touch it and appreciate the texture.

wrayal
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: Cranleigh, Surrey, England
Insane since: May 2003

IP logged posted posted 02-29-2008 21:31 Edit Quote

Hmm...seems like a nice idea. Here's mine:

My cube is a block of ice, scratched and misty but just about translucent. It floats just in front of my face. Perfect geometric cube, maybe about a foot on each side, asking to be toyed with, fiddled with spun around.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 03-01-2008 00:18 Edit Quote

PART II - THE LADDER
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Wrayal : Very similar to White Hawk but less charged, a LOT less, on the emotional side - more rational. Lots smaller also - a humble person apparently.
The word "scratches" troubles me here, the cold feel too - since this is a picture of yourself. There is something fragile about that,
yet the asking to be "toyed with, fiddled with spun around" - something very tipycal of a young man prone to few doubts
and wanting to get through that by developing social contacts.

...

To enhance a bit, now... get back to your cubes, and get ready for part II :

Ready? Back there with your cube? So add a LADDER to the scene.

(If anyone wants to throw their cube in at any given time, from now on I will continue with the ladder bits,
and will go through the whole interpretation for new cubes - so if you start now, add the ladder right after you have a clear picture of your cube.
Also, try to start considering you are at a fixed point in the desert, like a road - and let's see if this changes something.)


Side note about some of my above interpretations (regarding White Hawk) : I brought up the "perception mostly based on touch" because :

quote:

slightly rough to the touch. (...) pushed in any direction - seemingly weightless, but with mass. The edges are not sharp



Notice the words "pushed, weightless, mass, edges are not sharp". When getting to the core of his cube substance and shape, WH uses words that relate to physical perception.
For the rest of his text, it's all about "looks, I can see," etc. Fundamentally, this means his brain is wired (synapses) to focus on feelings coming from the eyes and physical contact -
but physical contact is at the center of his description. Generally, these kinds of sensory inclinations are with a person since day 1 : it's in the "flesh", or rather,
in the initial brain "config" so to speak.



(Edited by argo navis on 03-01-2008 00:19)

wrayal
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: Cranleigh, Surrey, England
Insane since: May 2003

IP logged posted posted 03-01-2008 00:38 Edit Quote

mm, I do see the resemblance looking back. This seems fun...if potentially quite revealing without even realising it...

My ladder is made of a faux-wood kind of plastic; tall but narrow, directly upwards set just to the side of my cube.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 03-01-2008 00:49 Edit Quote

* just bumping cause I sincerely am about positivy here and now*.

Boy you're ambitious, but you don't fully trust your skills yet. Let's see what comes next and I will explain further.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 03-01-2008 12:46 Edit Quote

A quick conclusion.
(@DL-44 - off topic, but thank you).

- As Blaise pointed out, there is a whole book about this and a great one at that.
- The standard, by heart cube "routine" will deliver informations on : ambitions, friends, love, problems, and how they relate to one another. And excellent cues at that
(the ladder represents your ambitions, the material and state represent your confidence in your ability, position of the ladder represents how you see your ambitions :
wrayal, they are close to you, and they are directed UPwards but the material is "fake wood", see what I mean?).

But the cube has another wonderful consequence : in general, either instantly, or days after - it makes you feel good about yourself, in touch with your inner reality.
And when exchanged appropriately, it does this for all involved.

Until next time, thanks to all of you who shared their cube.

White Hawk
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: zero divided.
Insane since: May 2004

IP logged posted posted 03-02-2008 14:08 Edit Quote

Hehe - instant image for me was of a gantry-style platform between step-ladders, over the cube.

argo navis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Switzerland
Insane since: Jul 2007

IP logged posted posted 03-02-2008 14:44 Edit Quote

Over the cube, for the ladder, tends to suggest you perceive your ambitions as above yourself.
The double ladder, also, may suggest two parallel areas for your goals : could be family and work, art and technique, etc. A duality of sorts

A ladder below the cube suggests that they are relatively insignificant to you.
Ladder detached from the cube - ambitions away from you.

To further help you understand your cubes, here is a little introduction to "submodalities".
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "submodalities" of perception vary slightly from person to person (the tendency to perceive more through touch, through sounds, etc.).
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try this at home, as an addendum/side note to the cube :
1) Start by picturing something VERY NEGATIVE (an object works best) - it is important you start in this order, it is CRUCIAL to your well being.
Allow it to become clear in your mind. Then spot where that image appears in your field of view.
Spot the colors, contrast, size, etc. characteristics of this very negative image.

2) Proceed by picturing something VERY POSITIVE (an object works best) -
Do the same exercises as in step one : observe how small, how big, how bright, how dark... the positive image appears.

Then let go of the mental representations.
Whatever happened, the negative thing's picture has very different characteristics from the positive one.

These are YOUR submodalities : it hints at the way your brain binds sensory informations and memory - bad means dark to some,
it means loud to others, it means sharp to others again. Some submodalities are very common, but many vary also.

The cube is a mental "hack" in that all human beings will represent that object, and the rest of what is in the scene
in relation to the areas of their self perception I outlined above. But representation of the details may have different meanings -
for different submodalities.

...If this is of interest to you, I recommend catching up on the threads about NLP I posted in the philo forum :
while this is not an exact science right now, it is absolutely amazing. Next thing...

If the mind has a "rom" (the cube and other common internal representations).
And some case-by-case "instruction sets" (submodalities are part of that).
Then it can be reprogrammed. This is the premise of NLP : the cube itself aims at simply enhancing "connection to the self",
it is very genuine and fun.

But can you imagine kicking off phobias, insomnia, or drug addiction this way? Thousands of psychologists worldwide do.
One of the fathers of this kind of "magic" (Milton) took it as far as PREVENTING PARALYSIS of some muscles for a child -
by setting her in a mental state where she would use other muscles reflexes to stimulate the paralyzed area inadvertently, and repeating
the exercise.

While it is not yet the panacea, it is being extensively studied for AI also - and one of the papers
I posted over in the Philo forum, speaking about the "7 matrices model", is still sending shivers down my spine
as it probably is the very best description of the human mind I have ever read.

The cube involves matrices of "the self" and "the world" (and later on, will involve the "matrix of others"). And that should wrap it up for now.

Game on.

(Edited by argo navis on 03-02-2008 14:49)

warjournal
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From:
Insane since: Aug 2000

IP logged posted posted 03-02-2008 15:50 Edit Quote

Been busy, and I have more about my cube.

What happens when you try to grasp my cube?

The first part depends on state of mind. Only those with true curiosity can touch it - all others will fail. When the curious touch it, it moves in an odd manner. If you touch it in one spot, it will move one way. If you touch it in another spot, it will move in a different direction. Sometimes it will rotate. It's motion and rotation is governed by simple rules. If touched here, then do this.

The rules seem simple, but they are more complex. As the curious minded masters the simple rules, it is soon discovered that the rules are not so simple after all. If touch x, then do y -- this is eventually discovered to be Every 5th touch on x, do z instead of y. And the complexity grows as the patterns are layered over each other - they only get more and more complex as they are discovered. Can be very frustrating and disconcerting.

There is another state of mind that is needed. With this extra state of mind, the meta-rule can be discovered. There exists one simple and elegant rule that all other rules and patterns are based upon. With this one simple meta-rule, my cube can be mastered.

For me and my cube, I can definitely see how this can be an introspection thing.

Hehehe.



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