Topic awaiting preservation: Anybody know more about this - S. 1867, the National Defense Authorization Act bill?

The worldwide indefinite detention without charge or trial provision is in S. 1867, the National Defense Authorization Act bill

I mean...wow?!

WTF is going on in America these days?

I mean...WTF!!!!

Who in the hell is driving this?

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

You're a kid.

you wouldn't know.

my stupid brain doesn't want to molest your little mind because you'd cry like a sissy.

Kind of a really lame response.

I am a kid. Okay.

I suppose, when compared to a mountain, you are right. Or perhaps the Earth.

As for my little mind...or crying like a sissy...

Tell me, the next time someone who matters to you is trying to push their guts back in, and you are there...

Will you cry like a sissy?

Fuck you.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

you saying you started this?

y'know, you're in over your head. you brag to the world you're on top and when you get down you can't strut. you're basically just a game.

considering the fact that all you know is what you care about. you have no feelings. you want the joy of other peoples feelings in your life and when it's time to give them the stake, you walk away without any shame.

just a toy. go fuck your own 9/11 suicide, bitch.

Say something real.

Tool.

Now, back to the topic - who is behind all this?

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

like what?

quote:

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helven said:

like what?

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quote:

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Say something real.

Tool.

---

You totally missed that one, didn't you.

Now, either respond to the topic, or fuck off.

I am not in the mood to banter with tools.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

Ouch that is a nasty bill.. bypassing the complete justice system for the sake of military.

Sounds like a totalitarian law to me.

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:: Develop yourself, develop your life, develop the world ::
:: Blog <--Dutch only ::
.........................................................................

just gearing up for class war 2.0. Nothing to see here. The guy next to you might be a brain eating zombie terrorist. Be scared.

It's about a month before 2012..

This is so wrong.

I don't know what to say. Let the Americans decide..

vinoun.com

Well, at least Obama has threatened to Veto it, should it pass.

Go Obama!

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

"The Senate is going to vote on whether Congress will give this president?and every future president ? the power to order the military to pick up and imprison without charge or trial civilians anywhere in the world."
civilians anywhere in the world!
Crikey!!

Going to have to think a spell afore I comment any further.



(Edited by Tao on 12-03-2011 01:58)

Well, it passed the Senate

I hope to gawd it does not pass the House!

Otherwise, only Obama stands between this monstrosity to civil liberties and the free world...

I still do NOT understand who is behind this! Who is pushing this, and why?

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

It's an interesting decision.

Obviously the intent is to restrict such "detentions" to people directly involved with terrorist acts and AQ related organizations. The concern comes in when we look at how broadly "hostilities against the United States or its coalition partners" is interpreted. The concern would exacerbated by allowing the use of military forces domestically but it seems to me that 1032(b)(1) might not authorize such action though the wording isn't definitive.

Overall, we have organizations such as the FBI which should be the point agency on matters of terrorism on US soil. I don't see any reason to override Posse Comitatus and start allowing direct military action domestically.

Could the "Occupy X" be the motivating idea behind this?

Just snatch them from the street, and off to Guantanamo?

No trial, no nothing...just indefinite confinement.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

I could get firmly behind that if it were the case but it isn't.

Law enforcement officials and the public in general have been remarkably patient with those spoiled assholes.

(Edited by Jestah on 12-04-2011 17:49)

now that's an awfully nuanced position to a fairly complex problem you have there sir.

getting 'firmly behind' "No trial, no nothing...just indefinite confinement." for anybody is quite a fascist notion...

so, those conspiracy theories like Alex Jones are right after all..

vinoun.com

Obviously I'm being facetious when it comes to the OWS'ers but I think cries of a totalitarian state are misplaced. I oppose this provision but like the POTUS I oppose it on the grounds that the FBI should be the lead investigation agency on U.S. soil and we uphold Posse Comitatus but recognize this is a unique crime that largely entails unique prosecution procedures.

A matter of secrecy is of the highest importance when it comes to combating terrorism but it is a matter of degrees. You might think we've gone too far but I don't. It takes all kinds to keep this world spinning.

Holy fucking shit!

Well, that was that! The end of the Bill of Rights.

I never, ever thought I would see a day like this in the United States.

I am dumbfounded, dismayed, and...I feel betrayed, as a citizen.

I guess I need to tone down what I say now, lest I be branded a terrorist and disappear...all legally.

All that remains is for Obama to sign it into law - it passed the House. And he says he will not veto it.

The America I once knew is dead.

Why don't we have a weeping slimie?

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

(Edited by WebShaman on 12-15-2011 14:17)

O oh..
The Founding fathers will turn in their graves/tombs.

.........................................................................
:: Develop yourself, develop your life, develop the world ::
:: Blog <--Dutch only ::
.........................................................................

What's the development WS?
Hook me up.
btw I did make a weeping slimie. I'll upload when I get home.

Found one of them but I think I need more WAILING

Well, this basically allows the President of the US to "get around" the Bill of Rights, Tao. Basically, all the President needs to do is declare an American Citizen (we will not get into foreigners) a Terrorist, and that person can be held indefinitely without due process of law.

In other words, the President of the US can have an American Citizen incarcerated indefinitely on the suspicion of terrorism indefinitely without having to go through a court of law.

So there will be no lawyer, no court, and no due process.

And yes, this is a case where your weeping slimie comes into play.

I am deeply, deeply ashamed, and dismayed at this. Words alone cannot express my feelings at this moment. Our country has betrayed that which has stood for 220 years.

On the other hand, I hope Obama declares Jestah a terrorist. Bye-bye, Jestah. Forever. No, you will not be able to do anything about it.

You will simply cease to exist. Legally.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

WebShamen said:

quote:

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I hope Obama declares Jestah a terrorist. Bye-bye, Jestah. Forever.

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Thank you for once again reminding me why this once vibrant community died, WebShamen.

(Edited by Jestah on 12-16-2011 17:13)

Oh come on, Jestah! It was just a little poke...

You know, humor?

I know you didn't vote for Obama, right? So, just his little way of getting back at you...

That sort of thing.

*sigh*

Used to be, that one could actually have some fun here...

And in regards to the topic, one can use a bit of humor here.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

I vote my dad for President next year.

\_/

Quitting is such a tragedy.