Topic awaiting preservation: Occam's Razor (Page 1 of 1)

I'm curious to see who knows of it

The Razor goes "The simpilest answer is usually the right one".

I personally try to go by it. It really does blow most conspiracies out the water. Usually the Razor tells the truth, but then again some conspiracy theories will never be gotten rid of since the truth will never be released. And ieven if the truth was released, some people so strongly believe the theory, they won't let it go. I'm sure that the world's governements have their dirty little secrets. The US, Britain, and Russia are the worst. Your thoughts?


This is not another pushy vegan thread.


Cell 650

I have a favorite variation of the Razor, it goes like this:

"Never attribute to Malice what can just as easily be explained by Stupidity."

Never heard of it/him/them.

I find that Occam's Razor offers pretty much the closest and smoothest shave of any commercially available razor. It's also got that built-in safety widget to prevent me from slicing open my jugular, which is always handy. On the other hand, it makes a pretty poor weapon, unless my intent is to remove every last body hair from my enemy and leave him naked in the Arctic.


___________________________
Suho: www.liminality.org

Suho, that reminds me of an episode of Courage: the Cowardly Dog.
A relative escapes from the insane asylum.
He likes to shave off the body hair of others while reciting poetry.
At the end of each stanza is always the word "...naughty..."

Only talked about Occam's Razor in science class.
I almost always found it discouraging because the deeper we dug the more complex things became.
I'm sure this can also be said of other application of the Razor.
You know, answers lead to more questions or something.


[This message has been edited by warjournal (edited 12-12-2003).]

Well - since you mention Occams razor and conspiracies in the same post, the question must be: Is the simplest explanation for the state of the world a conspiracy theory, or a multilevel sociological theory?

I have no answers, only guesses...

Or is it, as Occam's Razor suggests, the simplest explanation of all...that there is no cover-up (note: this is a blanket statement, dealing with all these 'cover-up' theories, and sooner or later they're all cover-up theories), but there is no evidence becuase there is no cover-up. Your choice of situation never actually happened.

And isn't it much simpler to assume all specfies were created by god, rather than assuming a complex theory like evolution?

Shure it seems like a very simple explanation that "there is no cover-up". Unfortunately this simple explanation was wrong so often in history that I am not ready to just assume it as right because it's simple. Just believing the "official version" of anything might seem "simple", as it frees you from thinking for yourself, but what if this version is actually NOT the most simple, logical, plausible explanation for what's going on?

The name is OCKHAM, by the way, not Occam. If one Aphorism by this guy is argument enough for you to disregard all alternate theories to explain things, you could at least spell his name right.

quote:

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And isn't it much simpler to assume all specfies were created by god, rather than assuming a complex theory like evolution?

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God... is not simple. What you see and believe of God is simple. You do not know what makes God work (effectively). God can do things simply, God is not simple. I'm repeating myself trying to find the words I need.

Ockham's Razor is a tool to narrow the search for truth in an area where myriad theories exist. It is not a tool to define the answer and ignore all other possibilities. No one here is doing that. It's an effort to get you to see that, while your theory is possible there are other theories, including the possibilty that the conspiracy doesn't exist. It isn't only those of us who don't believe in your conspiracy that are disregarding other alternate theories.



[This message has been edited by GrythusDraconis (edited 12-13-2003).]

MY conspiracy?

I just pointed out that Ockham's Razor, while somewhat useful in scientific and philosophical discussions, has no real relevance to the discussion of so-called conspiracy theories. I'm not into most of that "aliens control the government" crap - but I don't buy into seemingly simple explanations from notoric liars either, and that's the one thing ALL governments and secret services are by definition. Often enough what is fed to the public would be considered an idiotic consiracy theory if presented by anyone but the government.

So where's the factual proof that Osama bin Laden was actually behind the 911 attacks? Not saying he wasn't, I'm just playing devil's advocate, so tell me, where's the proof? That's the same question anyone with an alternate theory would be asked, right? And if all they had as proof were some bad video tapes, and the word of some unnamed experts, wouldn't you tell them to stop wasting your time?

I don't expect anybody to take any conspiracy theory at face value - But I'd love to see people question the offcial conspiracy theories just as thoroughly as they'd question any stuff from the internet. Especially when the official side has a lot to gain from selling you hot sh!t burgers.


I won't even get into the whole god issue... in order not to offend anyone, I'll just say that the example I used above (creationism/evolution) was badly chosen. What I tried to say was: The simplest explanation is not necessarily the right one,

quote:

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The name is OCKHAM, by the way, not Occam.

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Actually...the offical definition lists both spellings...now isn't that simple?

Now, MW, I must ask you...how do cover ups in histoy manage to consistute the majority? How many have been proven to be right? Please...enlighten us.

interesting, i've heard of occams razor, but never thought much about it . . . i prefer a double edge myself . . . and after looking around a bit, occam barely seems able to cut the mustard, let alone any kind of conspiracy theory.

(a blade that cuts both ways is best; if you can find it, let me know)

oops!

[This message has been edited by outcydr (edited 12-14-2003).]

Has anyone looked at the possibility that Occam/Ockham was actually involved in the conspiracy? First, you get people to accept the most obvious answer, then you can continue to carry out your devious and complex plan for world domination...Very clever, isn't it?

And misdirection is the only plausible explaination for why he would spell his name two different ways.

I would say more, but THEY might be monitoring this thread.

Occam's Razor is clearly a joke.

One needs only to watch their favorite soap opera to see that.

:::11oh1:::

Well here's a thread that could've been cool but didn't circle the shit pipe for very long. It went to pot just about right away. I'll just funnel this one away in my colon before shooting it across the room when I'm done being ill over it. =)

Occam's/Ockham's Razor is a tool used to explain things... not really something that you can "discuss" per se. So the thread sort of had a moot point to begin with.

Now conspiracy theories... there's something you can really get into discussion about...

I'm with you GD... but I'll stay out of the way of your flatulence, 'kay?