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Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 12-31-2001 21:42 hopefully, ya'll like this. it's gonna be my perm site for awhile. Comments?
JKMabry Maniac (V) Inmate From: out of a sleepy funk Insane since: Aug 2000	posted 12-31-2001 23:36 Yay! That's nice colors, much better. Now if you could juct get rid of those irritating animated GIFs Jason
Synthetic Paranoid (IV) Inmate From: under your rug, Insane since: Jul 2001	posted 12-31-2001 23:45 Looks very nice in MSIE 6.0, but I was suprised to see that Netscape 6.2 "their newest one" won't load your page at all except for all the blueish text in the center shows up fine. Did you already expect this?
Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 01-01-2002 01:00 Want me to remove yours JK? No. I wasn't expecting NS6 to fuck it up. All CSS should be compatible with that browser. Sheesh! Another 25 Mb download to check it. I knew it would fall apart in NN4, and anything under IE5, but this is a shock. Back to the drawing board...did I put my sniffer in there? Hmmm. Thanks for the heads-up.
skyetyger Bipolar (III) Inmate From: midair Insane since: Jul 2001	posted 01-01-2002 07:59 It is really stunning.. the colors and layout are beautiful.. Darn Navigator ! It is fine in IE5 and AOL
mr.maX Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Belgrade, Serbia Insane since: Sep 2000	posted 01-01-2002 10:22 Allewyn, instead of downloading bloated Shitscape 6, you can always download Mozilla, which is just under 10Mb... BTW Your page doesn't work correctly in Opera, either...
Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 01-02-2002 02:36 You're right Max, although O6 at least shows me that the center content box is high and left. Most of the page loads (I suspect it all does but some things are hidden behind others) so I can at least see where things are. I've checked to make sure all elements and properties are compatible with N6. All are but some were only included in N6. Using N6.2.1, it still looks terrible. I just can't decide why. Any help? I know that past versions of NN had trouble with absolute positioning...but Doc uses it and his works fine.
skyetyger Bipolar (III) Inmate From: midair Insane since: Jul 2001	posted 01-02-2002 08:20 Check for &-nbsp; or an empty cell... Navigator does the specs correctly.. an empty cell is collasped so stuff is overlayed and scrambled if a cell is not filled with &-nbsp. . .also a background color cannot be in a div even though IE5 will read it that way. From what I can determine, color has to be in a class.. these are the problems with overlaying I have with Nav..IE 5 does not collapse the cell if the div has a background color... how IE5 determines the cell sizing puzzles me..As I say I cannot read your code but it may help.. I prefer the way IE5 does it but Navigator is correct. btw..Allewyn ,what is remote?
Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 01-02-2002 20:45 sky - thanks for the feedback.as i'm not using any html besides <body> and <p>, i don't have cells. what you say about the background-color property was fixed (or supposedly fixed) in N6. i've gone back and commented out all post-ver 4 css and the site shows up now at least. looks woeful though, except n IE. elements are out of alignment, the dramatic feel i wanted, gone. i feel a rant coming on... oh, the remote in the header is another way of saying external.
GRUMBLE Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist From: Omicron Persei 8 Insane since: Oct 2000	posted 01-02-2002 20:54 btw: it seems as if you want to link either to me or to warmage, but you gotta choose! grumble != www.warmage.f2s.com [This message has been edited by GRUMBLE (edited 01-02-2002).]
Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 01-03-2002 18:02 rofl! looks like you gotta choose bud! arre you grumble or warmage? i'll take care of it.
Emperor Maniac (V) Mad Scientist with Finglongers From: Cell 53, East Wing Insane since: Jul 2001	posted 01-04-2002 01:53 Allewyn: I'm still having browser problems so I can't see it as it is intended but I have seen it looking not as you intended. I'll have a look at it and see if there is an easy solution but I suspect the problem is a common one (and one I've run across) in that you really need to test in other browsers as you build the page. I've come up with great looking pages in IE only to then test them in Op5 and NS6 and discover that they exploded. The general advice I give is that you should go back to basics and start building the site up from the basics testing in the other browsers all the time. It should be doable crossbrowser and it may even prove quicker than staring at it for ages, tweaking a few styles, staring, etc. Emps You're my wife now Dave
Emperor Maniac (V) Mad Scientist with Finglongers From: Cell 53, East Wing Insane since: Jul 2001	posted 01-04-2002 03:05 Allewyn: OK I'm now using IE6 and I see what you were aiming for. Two main areas strike me initially (with some pos. solutions): Menu 1. Use DIV not SPAN. 2. Try putting all menu items in one DIV and then have the others inside set to 100%. Top bar 1. Use a graphic!! There is so much code there that a 1 pixel wide graphic in a 100% wide DIV (same height as the graphic) with horizontal tiling would be a smaller download. Just because we are going for a non-tables approach doesn't mean we have to give up graphics!! Oh and the avatar - set the style to the image tag and just float it left - I don't know why there are font styles attached to this (ah it appears to be related to the 'Allewyn's Place' text which I can't see - separate them). And get rid of the positioning: use float and let the objects find their places (very Zen but I'm tired) the positioning is causing a lot of your problems. That should help with some of the problems (we can then track down the rest). Emps [edit: and having the date/time in the title will lead to some pretty unintelligible bookmarks/favourites - you aren't a news site so I don't see the need - if there were one put it in the page] You're my wife now Dave [This message has been edited by Emperor (edited 01-04-2002).]
Allewyn Maniac (V) Mad Scientist From: Solitary confinement Insane since: Feb 2001	posted 01-04-2002 21:54 Ok, the change from span to div gave me the menu look i wanted. not gonna use float on something i want to show people just yet lol! i don't understand it yet... I agree graphics should be retained in some form. I'm not at the place developing this site I want to add any yet Besides, I'm infatuated with CSS and it's cooler to do it with divs <grin> TAking out the time/date script next. I'll start a new thread with the next posting. It's gonna be cool if I can ge thte menu working in O6.

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Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 12-31-2001 21:42

hopefully, ya'll like this. it's gonna be my perm site for awhile. Comments?

JKMabry
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: out of a sleepy funk
Insane since: Aug 2000

posted 12-31-2001 23:36

Yay! That's nice colors, much better. Now if you could juct get rid of those irritating animated GIFs

Jason

Synthetic
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: under your rug,
Insane since: Jul 2001

posted 12-31-2001 23:45

Looks very nice in MSIE 6.0, but I was suprised to see that Netscape 6.2 "their newest one" won't load your page at all except for all the blueish text in the center shows up fine. Did you already expect this?

Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 01-01-2002 01:00

Want me to remove yours JK?

No. I wasn't expecting NS6 to fuck it up. All CSS should be compatible with that browser. Sheesh! Another 25 Mb download to check it.

I knew it would fall apart in NN4, and anything under IE5, but this is a shock. Back to the drawing board...did I put my sniffer in there? Hmmm. Thanks for the heads-up.

skyetyger
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: midair
Insane since: Jul 2001

posted 01-01-2002 07:59

It is really stunning.. the colors and layout are beautiful.. Darn Navigator ! It is fine in IE5 and AOL

mr.maX
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Belgrade, Serbia
Insane since: Sep 2000

posted 01-01-2002 10:22

Allewyn, instead of downloading bloated Shitscape 6, you can always download Mozilla, which is just under 10Mb...

BTW Your page doesn't work correctly in Opera, either...

Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 01-02-2002 02:36

You're right Max, although O6 at least shows me that the center content box is high and left. Most of the page loads (I suspect it all does but some things are hidden behind others) so I can at least see where things are.

I've checked to make sure all elements and properties are compatible with N6. All are but some were only included in N6. Using N6.2.1, it still looks terrible. I just can't decide why. Any help? I know that past versions of NN had trouble with absolute positioning...but Doc uses it and his works fine.

skyetyger
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: midair
Insane since: Jul 2001

posted 01-02-2002 08:20

Check for &-nbsp; or an empty cell... Navigator does the specs correctly.. an empty cell is collasped so stuff is overlayed and scrambled if a cell is not filled with &-nbsp. . .also a background color cannot be in a div even though IE5 will read it that way. From what I can determine, color has to be in a class.. these are the problems with overlaying I have with Nav..IE 5 does not collapse the cell if the div has a background color... how IE5 determines the cell sizing puzzles me..As I say I cannot read your code but it may help.. I prefer the way IE5 does it but Navigator is correct. btw..Allewyn ,what is remote?

Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 01-02-2002 20:45

sky - thanks for the feedback.as i'm not using *any* html besides <body> and <p>, i don't have cells. what you say about the background-color property was fixed (or supposedly fixed) in N6.

i've gone back and commented out all post-ver 4 css and the site shows up now at least. looks woeful though, except n IE. elements are out of alignment, the dramatic feel i wanted, gone. i feel a rant coming on...

oh, the remote in the header is another way of saying external.

GRUMBLE
Paranoid (IV) Mad Scientist

From: Omicron Persei 8
Insane since: Oct 2000

posted 01-02-2002 20:54

btw: it seems as if you want to link either to me or to warmage, but you gotta choose!
grumble != www.warmage.f2s.com

[This message has been edited by GRUMBLE (edited 01-02-2002).]

Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 01-03-2002 18:02

rofl! looks like *you* gotta choose bud! arre you grumble or warmage? i'll take care of it.

Emperor
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist with Finglongers

From: Cell 53, East Wing
Insane since: Jul 2001

posted 01-04-2002 01:53

Allewyn: I'm still having browser problems so I can't see it as it is intended but I have seen it looking not as you intended. I'll have a look at it and see if there is an easy solution but I suspect the problem is a common one (and one I've run across) in that you really need to test in other browsers as you build the page. I've come up with great looking pages in IE only to then test them in Op5 and NS6 and discover that they exploded. The general advice I give is that you should go back to basics and start building the site up from the basics testing in the other browsers all the time. It should be doable crossbrowser and it may even prove quicker than staring at it for ages, tweaking a few styles, staring, etc.

Emps

You're my wife now Dave

Emperor
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist with Finglongers

From: Cell 53, East Wing
Insane since: Jul 2001

posted 01-04-2002 03:05

Allewyn: OK I'm now using IE6 and I see what you were aiming for. Two main areas strike me initially (with some pos. solutions):

Menu

1. Use DIV not SPAN.

2. Try putting all menu items in one DIV and then have the others inside set to 100%.

Top bar

1. Use a graphic!! There is so much code there that a 1 pixel wide graphic in a 100% wide DIV (same height as the graphic) with horizontal tiling would be a smaller download. Just because we are going for a non-tables approach doesn't mean we have to give up graphics!!

Oh and the avatar - set the style to the image tag and just float it left - I don't know why there are font styles attached to this (ah it appears to be related to the 'Allewyn's Place' text which I can't see - separate them).

And get rid of the positioning: use float and let the objects find their places (very Zen but I'm tired) the positioning is causing a lot of your problems.

That should help with some of the problems (we can then track down the rest).

Emps

[edit: and having the date/time in the title will lead to some pretty unintelligible bookmarks/favourites - you aren't a news site so I don't see the need - if there were one put it in the page]

You're my wife now Dave

[This message has been edited by Emperor (edited 01-04-2002).]

Allewyn
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: Solitary confinement
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted 01-04-2002 21:54

Ok, the change from span to div gave me the menu look i wanted. not gonna use float on something i want to show people just yet lol! i don't understand it yet...

I agree graphics should be retained in some form. I'm not at the place developing this site I want to add any yet
Besides, I'm infatuated with CSS and it's cooler to do it with divs <grin>

TAking out the time/date script next.

I'll start a new thread with the next posting. It's gonna be cool if I can ge thte menu working in O6.