Topic awaiting preservation: Higher Learning (Page 1 of 1)

So I've been programming in PHP for about a year or so now and feel I have a very good grasp of the language. However, it is all self taught from web tutorials and code examples. Not to say that is a bad thing, but I may have picked up some bad practices along the way which I'm not aware of having. In any case, through my employer, I've been encouraged to take some courses on PHP. Namely, something along the lines of Optimizing my code for web and database server and all that it entails. I've googled everywhere in the last two or three days and Zend.com seemed to be the best bet. They even have a course entitled: PHP for Performance. This would be perfect except for the fact that the date of the next class is already past, and when I emailed them they said they are no longer offering their advanced courses seperately, they will be incorporated into multi-session packages, will let me know when as soon as they figure it out. Soooooooo.... still looking for a good legitimate place to take some courses online, where I don't have to do any traveling if possible. Any suggestions/ideas/reviews of good places would be greatly appriciated.

Thanks,

~Sir_KiTree~Scan~
..::ill communications network::..

(Edited by ~Sir_KiTree~ on 06-03-2005 14:36)

waste of time & money

Care to elaborate reisio?

taking a course on PHP is a waste of time & money

http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A//zend.com/
http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=zend.com%2Fstyles%2Fbasic.css&usermedium=all
http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=zend.com%2Fstyles%2Fzend_ent.css&usermedium=all
http://jigsaw.w3.org/css-validator/validator?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fzend.com%2Fstyles%2Fzend_inc.css&usermedium=all

http://validator.w3.org/check?verbose=1&uri=http%3A//www.zend.com/store/education/online-training/zend-online-training-courses.php%23Performance

These are not the sort of people to see to polish your "bad practices".

That's why I'm looking for other places...
As for the time and money, it's on my company's dime. Not that I want to waste their money, but I need something solid to show for, which consists of spending their money for educational purposes. But I totally agree with you reisio.

~Sir_KiTree~Scan~
..::ill communications network::..

So your are saying that CS majors are wasting time and money, and it's better to have uneducated masses doing the programming?

As an aside, I do realize that there are plenty of bad online classes / seminars.

It's not a complete waste of time, some people learn better through that medium. Some people learn better on their own through reading. If you can do the latter, you'll save a lot of time and money. I have friends learning things that I've known for years about programming and their spending money to learn it and still some to me asking me for help with their classes, yet I've never taken a single web technology class in my life. However there are also those that have excelled in the college courses they take and pay for that I go to for advice and help on some of my projects. It's more a matter how best one learns.

~Sir_KiTree~Scan~
..::ill communications network::..

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F1_error said:

So your are saying that CS majors are wasting time and money, and it's better to have uneducated masses doing the programming? As an aside, I do realize that there are plenty of bad online classes / seminars.

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No, I'm saying if you can read and find a library or get online, you're wasting time and money (unless you just want to be some drone as part of a giant corporate ladder, then by all means, college classes are for you).

Obviously some people don't learn well by reading books, but I certainly hope that's not the majority.

Anyways don't mean to derail thread, just my opinion. Will keep my eye out for any courses that look good.

(Edited by reisio on 06-03-2005 18:13)

have you checked with your local community colleges or even colleges and uni's there? The main university here offers an "adult" program to allow for evening and online courses.

Not sure what you are really looking for. I am guessing from what you said in the first post that you are looking for something to take while working full time. Yes? If that is the case then look into the comminity colleges, colleges and universities. Or even a place like New Horizons that offer degrees based only on one subject like programming or A+.

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~Sir_KiTree~ said:

I've been encouraged to take some courses on PHP.

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Hell if thats the case make them pay for it too Could offer to sign a contract saying you wont leave until ~2-3 years after you complete. That would just secure your job and you get an education :P

Later,

C:\

First if you are going to learn PHP Zend is the company formed by the founders of PHP. It's a good source. (Proving they don't validate CSS doesn't mean a thing if I'm looking for someone to teach me PHP).

It should also be mentioned that many employers feel more comfortable knowing their employees have been formally trained outside of just "book learnin'"



.:[ Never resist a perfect moment ]:.

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bitdamaged said:

Proving they don't validate CSS doesn't mean a thing if I'm looking for someone to teachme PHP

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fantasy land

reisio, outputting valid CSS doesn't make you a good PHP programmer. It's like choosing a company to pour your house's foundation based on the quality of the construction of their offices. I agree, however, that a performance PHP class is probably a waste of time for a few reasons:

A) general programming wisdom (picking the right algorithms / data structures) is far more important than language-specific details.
B) bandwidth tends to be the bottleneck for most web apps, unless you have very complicated code.
C) if your code base is that complicated, PHP may not be the best choice anyway.

However, what really made me reply was this:

quote:

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No, I'm saying if you can read and find a library or get online, you're wasting time and money (unless you just want to be some drone as part of a giant corporate ladder, then by all means, college classes are for you).

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The statement about being a drone in a corporate ladder applies more to trade schools and certifications than it does to a real computer science program. Actually there is a lot of complaining from computer science students that there's too much theory and not enough practical programming which is what they need to get corporate jobs.

I'm not saying people who go to college are better programmers than the self-taught, because natural curiosity and talent are probably the biggest factor. However, I guarantee that if YOU go through a respected computer science program, YOU will be a much better programmer. The whole point of college is that you get exposure to all kinds of important things that you never would have even thought to look up, and you do it in an environment where you can bounce ideas off top experts working on the bleeding edge of technology. Even if you manage to read all the right books, do all the right projects, and have the discipline to work hard on things you don't like in your spare time, you still wouldn't be getting the feedback that you get in college.

-jiblet