Topic: UML, Misunderstandings, biases, and a good laughter :: blunt sarcasm ahead (Page 1 of 1)

/!\ DISCLAIMER: if you can't read the following with humor, if it makes you cringe, don't come whining. If it does hurt your feelings, then you probably
are one of the persons I mention and you have RARELY PAID ME RESPECT. Expect being paid back or move to the next thread.

Oh, and by the way, the normal readers should expect DL-44 to drop by and attack me out of the blue, in a verbose (but sometimes sensible) way,
the target "raving Trio" to whine their asses off, TP to threaten me of banishment, and some banter about "my being impolite", as they will cringe before the blunt truth.
Probable other "good order" advocates include bitdamaged or Warmage.
Why? They will assume, based on their internal biases, I am attacking the community, although I am trying to get some fun off the most intense display of idiocy
made by two people in a long time.
I have gotten used to these reactions, it seems to happen everytime I raise a controversial point - wether that point could be constructive or not - it is ASSUMED destructive.

You should not expect anyone to make a constructive move towards a better understanding after this, but it will just be soo usual to me.
Might as well unleash my true feelings about this whole thing.


Well

To those of you who still are prone to misunderstanding, judging me and turning the heat on for "all available reasons", keep in mind for the rest of your lives that "my love for you is like diarea"



"I just can't hold it in".
It's coming./!\


Is this whole thing really laughable. Or plain scary? Yeah, some of you sometimes scare me.
Is it possible to have a brain and use it so poorly because of emotional biases? Yes, it actually happens all the time to everybody.

And it happens particularly often to some people.

UML as described by IBM:

quote:

---

The Unified Modeling Language? (UML?) is the industry-standard language for specifying, visualizing, constructing, and documenting the artifacts of software systems. It simplifies the complex process of software design, creating a

"blueprint" for construction.

---

And a couple of papers from the IEEE (google IEEE-SA to see that IEEE is in every single click you make) about web applications reverse engineering:
* http://csdl2.computer.org/persagen/DLAbsToc.jsp?resourcePath=/dl/proceedings/&toc=comp/proceedings/icsm/2005/2368/00/2368toc.xml&DOI=10.1109/ICSM.2005.77
* http://csdl2.computer.org/persagen/DLAbsToc.jsp?resourcePath=/dl/proceedings/&toc=comp/proceedings/wse/2002/1804/00/1804toc.xml&DOI=10.1109/WSE.2002.1134087

Basically, UML obviously IS the de-facto standard for any software vendor.
Basically, it is involved and deeply integrated in any decent IDE nowadays, borland, Visual Studio, and used by almost all development companies worldwide.
IEEE and IBM agree about the importance of UML in software design, and IEEE says almost EXACTLY WHAT I SAID about reverse engineering web applications such as the Asylum.

Would you even argue about the benefits of web standards? I mean, it is always possible to argue, but does it make sense when such a standard has been established
by the proven experience of a whole industry over years?



THEY DID!

I mean.

They tried. It would have taken arguments to make a point.
They have carefully avoided making any.


--------------- motivations of this miscommunication case study
Original discussion:
http://www.ozoneasylum.com/27269

As a matter of facts, some people here have a strong bias against me, a tendency to see and hear everything I do in the light of
"I want to manipulate you in my plan to conquer the world".

I am not blaming them, being a cunt is a right, if not a privilege: they have earned it by vigorously refusing new ideas,
refusing constructive criticism, and thinking they are know-it-alls.
I think cunts on this planet have a talent at doing their thing. Really.

Sticking to the past to justify the present is a good way to get a rank in the Darwin awards, me thinks, instead of drawing the line
and assuming, for a second, that I could be honest, willing, and simply right.
If their goal is to be weeded out by evolution, sticking to past events to stand on biased stances is plain perfect.

I even think some should call Guiness and compete, there is material for a world cup and records.

Or? Some people.. yeah some people probably should really be turned into sponges. They're wasted braincells.
Which would surely help our Darwin award competitors reach their goal.

Since shaking those dead braincells may help some wake up, I'll shake hardly.
It may only result in the usual wussies war dance. At least that'll be funny to watch.


--------------- the discussion: my point, and the way it was perceived.

My point was giving an advice to a community about it's software tools.
The intent? Constructive.

The reaction of concerned "moderators"? It really cracked me up... see for yourself:


--------------- q&a, InI vs the raving trio

quote:

---

InI:
writing to a text file is in general faster than accessing a db.

Raving G:
yes it is. cause writing to a db is also writing to a file + the db engine routines.
and if im not mistaken, all pages at the grail software are therefore rendered to files everytime someone changes something.

InI (obviously adressing the db access == text file access assumption):
You are mistaken, and that's a good reason to clarify things on a larger scale.
One, among the twenty differences I could quote off the top of my head is: db query = dedicated db server = (random/unpredictable) transfer times added to the text processing.

Raving K (obviously hasn't seen what my comment was targetting):
Just a short intervention as he isn't quite, actually.
The last 100 or so threads that have been viewed are cached and solely accessed as static files by those who do not add their own reply, reducing the number of DB queries quite a bit already.

---

....
15 posts or so, and we're still stuck in what originally was "one real world example of POSSIBLE benefits of accurate modelling". The grey matter of our raving trio is still digesting
this sole, random example.



Aim: suggesting a possible structural improvement.
Perception: an attack.
Reminder: the topic was "A faster forum using accurate modelling techniques"



But to the raving trio, the real world example is still a tough one to swallow.

At LEAST raving K has had the common sense of staying polite.
There's much to say about the way Grumble reacted, taking it as "someone protecting him from the evil guy who is daring to give an advice."
And the use of the word "intervention" by Kuckus, very U.S. Marshallish, one would think I am Osama himself, threatening the masses
of showing them UML is easy and useful (of course since UML is a part of my plot for taking over the woooorld).

But ok, it was off-topic from Kuckus, but fair and polite.
- At this point, though, I start to cringe at the absence of understanding.


Hint to Grumble: it is NOT because TP has implemented this improvement already that there aren't better ways to implement it, or others.
The fact TP has implemented this already shows he cared for ONE POSSIBLE improvement in a million, it doesn't say shit about
"A faster forum using accurate modelling techniques", the idea itself had little to do with modelling aside acting as an EXAMPLE.

It also says THIS BOTTLENECK CAN BE PREDICTED SINCE I HAD GUESSED IT WOULD HELP.
I am about sure the proposed workaround wasn't implemented from the start, wasting the time required to NOTICE IT WOULD HELP and finally ADD IT.

Plot of the thread, where art thou? Common sense? Ability to rtfm from Grumble? They're on holidays. Permanent holidays.

15 posts to not get over the "basic example" and not understand anything of what is being said by me.

--------------- Next, it ALMOST took off

quote:

---

Raving G:
well, if that helps you optimize the grail, then what are you waiting for?

InI (having created a faq entry and laid out a base scenario in order to SHOW and PROVE a constructive intent):
Ok, there now are a bunch of faq entries for this whole stuff.
http://www.ozoneasylum.com/27276

InI:
See? My point is not to say "I know better than you" or "can do better than you", my point is not to despise Grumble, my point is not to get myself involved
in the Asylum and "take it over" (muhuhahahaha) (I am waaaay too lazy, moody, and busy to maintain the Asylum code on the spare time I don't have - unless a hand is required for a given task,
which is all I have the time to give but would give with pleasure).

I have to stress the TIME I WOULD GIVE WITH PLEASURE IF WE HAVE A PLAN part.


Raving TP, the undisputed champion of the world:
You could have gotten the grail code in the past and drawn your own diagramms - instead of trying to get other people to spend their time on them.

---

Huh-huh. So I am BASICALLY putting my hands in the dirt first and foremost to hear the heavyweight champion
of all times encourage me with something about "manipulating the world into my plot for dominion (muhuhahahaha) and having them waste their precious time over..."
Over reviewing the work I have started doing in the faq.


Aim: proposing my work AND to involve the whole community to get the most comfortable result.
Reaction: blaming me for trying to "manipulate the world into handing me diagrams for me to lazilly caress myself over".

..Hey, Beavith, I got diagrams, I can get chicks. Huh. Huh.



- At this point in space and time, I am crying tears of hysteria, this is great, just great, I'll never be able to stop myself from laughing.

I think every dumbass on the planet is jealous of you TP. Gold medal awarded. In ONE SINGLE POST!
"Priceless" if you know what I mean

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I should stop here though, it just is crazy.
My bad, I have made too long posts for people to read and understand the whole at a glance. Still, when you remove internal biases
and get past a tendency to moronic behavior, it is quite obvious that the intent is constructive.

When will some of you people get over emotional biases to ACTUALLY TRY AND HEAR WHAT I HAVE TO SAY BEFORE TRYING TO ANSWER NONSENSE?

------------------------------ TP's inner child

quote:

---

InI (pay attention to my saying I FULLY TRUST HIS CODING ABILITY):
I've learnt that planning is extremely important when it comes to software development, and the immense effort by TP has gone through so many changes, tips, ideas, etc. Such an awkward process that
while I fully trust his coding ability, I am wondering wether the grail is giving it's full potential or not.

TP (pay attention to his mistaking my ADVICE for DESTRUCTIVE CRITICISM):
Get a life.

Believe what you want to believe.

---

Read this a few times, and notice the way he takes it personal, thinking I am treating him like a cunt when all I am saying is "it's excellent but it always can be improved with best practices".
Notice the underlying insecurities.
Notice the rebellious attitude at my "trying to share knowledge instead of having a life".

It almost would make me want to give him a sloppy kiss and a hug.
Or a punch in the face to man-bitch-slap the wuss out of him.

Or both.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
An effortless victory and silver medal also on Grumble's side, with a unique persistence in re-asking the same questions ten times
and not getting a dime of the heavy answers and links provided.

Which would be common and ok in a forum environemnt without the "my inner wuss has been wounded over your daring to try to answer questions" tirade.

Next runner up.
And a potential future champion.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

All in all, we had one coder wanting to share, two talented morons on a rampage because they don't like me and theyre inner wussies can't stand advice, Kuckus taking a secure stance but missing my point altogether,
one coder getting something to the whole point (twoD) and a simple user/talented graphic artist getting something to the discussion as well (the trout concept and the fact it can easilly become reality).



Had it only been one of them, it would have been acceptable, but two of them having their inner child wounded by
a simple tip about UML.

Also, pay attention to the way they don't provide any technical argument to prove their point, or relevant links, don't have anything to say
about UML (ah yeah, the brilliant "it's a heavy specification" - no shit? We have a new Sherlock! -, hardly understand shit to what's going on and try to protect their insecure selves with brilliant phrases like:

quote:

---

This is my last and first post in this thread.

---

Which prevents from having to try to make a point at all.

Easy.

and

Cute.

Ah yeah, TP posted a cheap and confused (I read it all) 1986 article before running away in fear of what? Showing he does not know it all?
Having the balls to accept an advice and give it a proper evaluation? Having the balls of admitting the Asylum may be an admirable, yet imperfect piece of work?
Having the balls of accepting I could have given this advice without any inherent boobytrap AND I could be right?

That's why he is the champion


"Hey, Beavith, I am the wuss that time forgot. Phear me."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The moral of the story?

You two have misred, misinterpreted, distorted my words to make them match your internal biases, questionned what is the reference framework for modelling, during a couple of mediocre posts
about nothing, and then ran away.
Making for a fantastrippic documentary about those weird animals called dumbasses.


I had to thank you. Keep being winners.

ok i jumped the last bit of your post but i read the original post.
i appreciate your attempt of trying to make the asylum better. but the way you tried it was completely wrong. You where writing as if you where the only one to know UML or other methods of Softwaredevelopement. But i know that Grumble is damn good at these things and has finished(or is soon to finishe) his studies in computer science. Treating him like a fool or a small child will result in him becomming emotional.


And then to what you where saying was that someone else should do the work and TP should implement it as if he where a fulltime Asylum maintainer. He has a job like most people here and drawing compley UML diagramms or to formulate usecases for such a "small" software like the Asylum is is a waste of time(in my oppinion). The Asylum does not have 10s of thousand querrys a day it does not have a problem with speed (look at cgtalk.com if you want to see a forum that hast problems with speed).

Hey Mauro... take it easy. The World against you, episode XXVI? You're interpreting so much more into this than there ever would have been in the other thread.
Really.

Well anyway. I'll get out of here and stop raving and intervening for a bit, I think. Hope others do the same.

You apperantly have way too much time on your hands - so get a life.


UML would never have predicted where the grail spent most of it's time. It actually was in parsing a php array() encoded user to cell table that simply took 15 ms to parse. Heck, even a php profiler wouldn't have caught it.
The bottleneck you predicted isn't one. The file caching of quieries was because Dreamhost used to charge for queries. It did not improve speed in a measurable way
But I'm almost certain I won't be able to get that point across to you after you've spent serveral hours and hundreds of lines of text convincing yourself otherwise - so I wasn't going to bother...

I've been opposed to both your last ban and the text mutilation you requested, but I'm not going to read all that text from you above - unless someone pays me by the hour.

If you have anything to say, keep it short.

An appropriate way to phrase what you wanted to accomplish would have been:
"I'd like to draw UML diagrams for the grail so maybe I could make some suggestions for improving it. Can I have the code?"

Not: "I want you to draw UML diagrams for the grail so I can show you what you botched." - which is what was received at this end.


I'm off into a nice and quiet sunday.
fellow Mad Scientists, you have the bridge.
So long,

->Tyberius Prime

Today, I took some old phone books and catalogs to the recycling center, donated a few books to my local library, went by the utility office to pick up a recycling bin to put my empty beers in, took some older software to sell at the used-book store and shopped for some essentials (and a Duff Beer hat). Next, I'll categorize some photos, cook a pot pie, do some laundry, then go downtown to meet a friend.

Yet I could have just stayed home to measure and catalog the fibers in my carpet and still felt more productive than this thread.

^ And a very fine carpet it is.

Good to see you still hold a grudge after fucking yourself over and over old buddy

rock on wit' yo' bad seff

Wes - I got the blue fibers covered, you can count the green.

Mmmm carpet... whoops! Wrong thread, sorry 'bout that

Back on topic, I don't doubt anyone in here who's read atleast parts of all the posts understands the basic concept of UML. After all, we're programmers, right? How else did we get here if we didn't have any structural models to build on?

With that sorted out, how about skipping all the insults even if one is pissed off because somebody missunderstood the point? Do you want them to remember the point(s) you've made (be they correct/incorrect/critical/off topic/dumb/idiotic/crazy/mad/or even pointless) or the insults thrown around when seeing your name on a post? The big associative engine we call a brain do seem to associate people with their negative actions towards you rather than the positive ones...

And don't forget, stop taking things so bloody personal! It's boring to have to sort out the useful information in an ocean of offensive and defensive speeches about single quotes when you just want to know what the poster is saying about the topic.


!!! DISCLAIMER: This post is directed towards nobody in particular and everyone else, including any previously excluded participants, observers and non-participating individuals in this and similar or related conversations (which includes the previously mentioned thread, of which only a few quotes was included in this thread, and the rest excluded due to excessive use of quote includation and context excludation). This post means no harm but tries to be informative with a slapping touch of madly drunk humor since the poster happens to be slightly drunk (passing on towards a hangover) at the moment and not so slightly mad at all other moments.

/TwoD

Is there a real point to this thread

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

Nope,

Clicking this link.. will help me in my game....

quote:

---

_Mauro said:

...if you can't read the following with humor,...

---

You forgot to bring the funny.

Hmmmm... I was bitter, indeed.

I do deserve a straightjacket btw, a solid and cozy one. But let alone this fact, I can see my "getting nervous and venting"
over a sensitive suggestion which backfired at me, and it sounds like a human reaction.

It's just that.. I am concerned, believe it or not.
Technology and knowledge are behind most of my posts, and we all "love" both.
And this particular knowledge base / playground known as the Asylum still has something unique, it still is one of the only places where advanced ideas are discussed daily.

As far as I am concerned, I am getting there software-design wise.
From self-trained script kiddie to engineer, I am getting to have an "overview" of software design in all it's expressions.

Software conception to assembler to high-level user interfaces, advanced graphics, algorithmy, computers structure, networking, artificial intelligence, system administration,
I now have a *good* good grasp and solid experience of them all.


And I hate to break the myth, but the way I see the Asylum right now, it's getting huge.
It has best practices, policies, it has a structure, proven to work.

It looks a bit like a cathedral.

So while I fully respect a man's willpower and talent in building a cathedral.

I must admit it has issues, as any application, even the most wisely designed ones.
Who talked about casual "lags"?

So I still see a time, in the future, when people won't be able to cope, and the amount of data in it will crack the flaws open.
Users will go (how do we save/maintain/make this thing evolve from now on?)
Resulting in headaches a plenty.

And I see, on the other hand, the possibility of a smooth, or automated, transition, using blueprints that are standards, can be understood by anybody,
used by any available code monkey, and drawn very easilly.

Grumble raised a moot point when bringing up the complexity of UML. It is a "norm", not a programming language, so it merely specifies
best practices....
...based on the considerations above.

TP's stance is still making me cringe, it's Microsoft's stance towards UML: "we have our own internal best practices, f* the world."

------

I do use Java because it is a standard way to deploy applications, it makes for scalable, flexible, rock solid apps.
I do like javascript, xhtml, css, and web standards, for the same reasons.
I do tend towards "building to reach the maximum audience".
It needs foundations.

This topic still has a bitter taste.
So, I'll bring the funny somewhere else, on some other occasion.