Topic: Wm Guild

Hello im a member of a Group called the Webmasters Guild
and we've recently updated the site layout
and i was wondering who i could get a decent opinon of and i automaticaly thought of you guys

so id really appreaciate it if you guys picked on every tiny little point and where absolutly brutal so we can make this site look perfect
thanks
Trigger

http://billysielu.co.uk/WM-Guild/

First impression: "is that it?"

I don't like this crappy text that you're using for "the webmaster guild......... keep it real" stuff. It's at the bottom of the page as well..... "design by sphincter... blah blah"

I'm not all that sure of what effect/look you're going for here.
I mean..... it's completely hollow.... and there's lines running every which direction for no apparent reason.
I see no flow to this site.
And if you really wanna get nit picky/stoopid...... it looks like the orange line is 1 pixel off from the blue/grey line in the upper right. I dunno if that's intentional or not. The simple fact that I don't know if it's intentional or not, is reasoning enough to change it.

At the moment... the progression of this site only has things loading on that left side.
You're whole navigation takes up the entire layout (which doesn't span the screen I might add)..... and yet you shuffle all your content that the navigation calls.... into a small rectangle on the left portion of the screen. It just doesn't make sense my friend.

And that little scrolly thing......
couldn't you make it stop at the bottom of the text or something...

Even with an added effort, I find it hard to like anything that's going on here.
The layout seems cheap, weak, and ineffective.
You leave space at the top for a banner-style layout.... yet the only thing up there is some text in a crappy font, that is for some ungodly reason followed by "keep it real".

I realize I'm not handing out an abundance of alternative ideas at the moment.... but I think that sitting down and sorting all of this out on paper is the route to go. A whole new plan of attack; Re-defining your purpose, audience, and content..... and most certainly making a group effort for a new layout.

If you expect people to come to you for assistance.... then dammit the layout's gotta be smooth and highly usable....
An eight year old kid with good skills could make this thing with an etch-a-sketch.

[This message has been edited by Michael (edited 06-29-2002).]

Try stacking the navigation on the left side, put them all in one columm instead of 2. Then, move your text thing over and make it a lot larger. This will lend itself better to the eye's natural progression over the page.

Is this a spin-off of the IWA? I've been an IWA member for some time. Thought that was where I was going...

Everyboby's doing angles these days, nothing new there. High contrast, nothing new there. http://www.webwhirlers.com/colors/ This site could help you with color.

Your site has an upper resolution limit of some kind? It sat in the upper-left corner of my screen and wouldn't come down. Must be aligned left. Ah, frontpage. When you write your own HTML, try us again.

Allewyn

I asked for a review
not to be patranised for uisng a Tool to aid creation of something
i didnt personaly make the page im a member of the Guild that did
and whats the IWA? and whats your problem?

so how about we stick to the subject yes?
or i could go on about how your "site" has at least 2 dead links very proffesional work

Thanks
Trigger


[Edit I read your post a second time and it has no constructive crtiscm at all
all's you've done is slated the fat members of the Wmguild use Frontpage
next you will be telling us we should paint everything and draw everything our selves and not use the likes of Photoshop? i dont intend to get in a flame war with you so how about you just lose the attitude ]



[This message has been edited by Trigger (edited 07-07-2002).]

Hey dipshit.... open your fucking eyes please.
You've made an attack on someone else's site while asking for a site review yourself..... simply because you didn't like what they were saying. Kindly remove your head from your ass.

In your second post, you say... "I asked for a review".....
Yes... yes you did.... However... I might also add, that you said in your first post... "so id really appreaciate it if you guys picked on every tiny little point and where absolutly brutal so we can make this site look perfect"

So if you want things picked apart... and you want brutality, don't fuckin' cry to mommy when you get it.

I might also add... I didn't find Allweener's remarks all that "bashing".
Let's break it down... shall we?

Allewyn says...
"Is this a spin-off of the IWA? I've been an IWA member for some time. Thought that was where I was going..."
What does that tell you?
That your site immidiately reminds him of another site, and perhaps you should look into that further in order to see where differences and similarities lie, in order to create this site's own web identity.

Allewyn says...
"Everyboby's doing angles these days, nothing new there. High contrast, nothing new there."
What does that tell you?
Your site is nothing out of the ordinary. 9 year old children around the world are doing the same thing.... And doing it better.
If this site were doing it better than the other 9 year old children, I'm confident in my mind-reading skills that Allewyn would have said so... but he did not.... and i'd have to agree.... it isn't.

Allewyn says...
" http://www.webwhirlers.com/colors/ This site could help you with color."
What does that tell you?
Well, i find this one pretty much self-explainatory...... apparently you didn't get that memo.
You griped that no constuctive criticism came from the post..... YET... I'd say a link to a little colour wheel of sorts, would be quite helpful. Allewyn isn't telling you how to fix your shit.... he's offering a place to help guide you through fixing part of your shit.

Allewyn says...
"Your site has an upper resolution limit of some kind? It sat in the upper-left corner of my screen and wouldn't come down. Must be aligned left. Ah, frontpage. When you write your own HTML, try us again."
What does that tell you?
You should look into making your site "liquid"...OR center it..... rather than having it all bunched up in the corner.
(And as far as I know... Frontpage doesn't do too well in the cross-browser category... Soooo... I'd assume that Allewyn might slightly be refrencing that thought).. HOWEVER... i don't think that's what Allewyn is getting at.... I think he's saying.... learn to code your own shit, rather than relying on the likes of that rediculous program.


So.... as i've said... remove your head from your ass.
Do not request reviews.... and ask that people be nitpicky and brutal... and then turn around and insult their own site.
I'm confident that you are not hearing the majority of what i'm saying, therefore, in the event you go running off to my site to bash it..... YES... It's only one page.... it only has one picture... and No... i don't plan on putting a damn thing up... Okay, thanks, buh-bye.

Also....
YOU asked for this review.... We all realize that you did not create it...
But i'd like to point out.... in your first post, you said... "Hello im a member of a Group called the Webmasters Guild
and we've...."
Yes... that's right.... You are claiming a bit of ownership to it, due to the fact that you are a member.... And you know what?.. we don't care about that.... BUT when we go on about "YOUR site... this" .. and .. "YOUR site ... that" .... don't whine.

And about your little comment when you edited your message....
I don't think it's wise to compare FRONTPAGE.... to PHOTOSHOP around this crew. That's a whole new animal waitin' to get out.
Furthermore...
when you said, "i dont intend to get in a flame war with you so how about you just lose the attitude"...
You just started one.

NOW.... I don't mind the flame wars.....
SO.. you've got a couple options......
a.) continue this bullshit with me in email, ICQ, or even right in this thread, if we must.
b.) apologize to Allewyn.
c.) go back to the hole you came from.


Lastly...
In the event that you don't return to the asylum.... do Doc the favor of not bad mouthing the place just cause you got in a little tiff with one of the resident assholes.... it's a great forum.

Cheers,
Michael

Shit
now i could come out with some bullshit why im being such a dip shit
but i wont bore you guys


Michael thanks for putting me in my place its appreciated beyond belife

Allewyn id like ot sincerly apoliges for the comments i made though your not likley to have read them yet

Though in my half dazed state your comments seemed very vague and just seemd like total bashing with out any constructive input
now Michael enlightend me i can see it all clearly now

so one agian
Sorry Allewyn
and Thank You Michael

*Waits for the smoke to clear*

Well, first of all, my estimation of you went back up again quite a bit after reading your reply to Michael's criticism. At first I thought maybe you were being sarcastic, but then I realized you weren't. Impressive. We all like inmates who can take their medicine.

Just a few comments (nothing new, just my take on the site). First of all, the scrolling kind of bugs me. Personally, I don't like mouseover scrollers, but maybe that's just because I'm spastic. People expect to have to click on something to get it to work, and it can be disorienting when the text flies off (and it does scroll rather quickly) like that. Speaking of the speed, what if that's too fast for some of your readers? You've left them with no other choice for navigating the text. Your scrollbar leaves out an important element: the bar itself. You know that block thingy that moves up and down the scrollbar? Well, it serves two purposes: 1) to give the user an alternate way of scrolling the text, and 2) to indicate how much of the total text currently appears on the screen. Oh, and having an end point to the scroll (as Michael mentioned) would be very helpful, too.

Secondly, I want to emphasize something that me~ said about the navigation: stacking the navigation in one column on the left. As you probably know, most sites out there put their navigation on the left; it's become pretty standard. There is a reason to put the navigation on the right, though (and there are many sites that do this as well), and that is because it is closer to the scrollbar, which means less mouse movement back forth across the screen as you go from page to page. With your scrollbar being where it is (and split into two), there's not as much reason to have it on the right.

Finally, pretty much everyone has pointed out the site's lack of fluidity. Make it liquid, or at least center it.

(And now, a few words from our sponsor)

People have certain expectations when surfing on the web. When you design contrary to those expectations, you need to ask yourself if your departure from convention has a good reason. If the benefits of the design outweigh the possible disorientation a user may feel, than go with it. If there are no real benefits (in your site, for example, the scrollbar), sticking with convention may be safer.

That's just my personal philosophy. Take it for what it's worth.




Cell 270

no it was ment sinceraly
and Thanks for the comment Suho ill pass them all on to the guild and
well see what new site we can muster up

Glad to hear it. Open mindedness is a good thing.

I'll be looking forward to seeing what you guys come up with.

Kinda flat isn't it? Looks like the interface for the computers they used to have on Star Trek NG

Maskkkk




- Face the Present

well Done mask
it is a interface ya right
and most of the Wmg members are Startrek fans
but 1+1 toghter and you get 2
unless your takeing part in the whys
1+1=2 theead :P