Topic: PsPong.com layout Proposals (Page 1 of 2)

Well I thought of a idea and more to come about PsPong. Most people are getting ideas and I thought I would like to help give people ideas about the layout, colours, ect for it. I would like as I said Here to try and get out of the old looks of the sites linked with the asylum (I know it sounds bad but look at the idea).

Idea 01 well this is the first idea mock up type I had for it, colourful yet has modern look about it. Don't know how it would all work yet maybe all the content and things go into the boxes, anyone got any ideas on it would work?

Any ideas you have concerning ideas for layouts for PSpong post them here if you want .


Chris C

Well Dark I like the colors and it looks good, but how bout you put a menu with sime similar graphics to the left and scoot the rest to the right, taking up most of the space in 800 by 600 resolution..... Looks good so far though, I will get back to you with ideas though....

[This message has been edited by InSiDeR (edited 12-02-2001).]

DS: Nice work (and quick too) and I get a better idea about what you mean about a more modern look. I like the way you've brought in the background from znippets.com as well!! I suspect things like the logo and colours are still up for negotitation but that is a good promising start and should at the very least provoke debate into the design. I do like the idea of little window boxes and we could do something similar to the sub window idea being used by the Doc, Slime, dhtmlcentral.com, etc. which would work very nicely. I suppose that most people are now happy working in an environment with new windows in them so it would work intuitively as well. This approach will clearly require some hefty input from one of our DHTML gurus here: Anyone?

I can see how this design could be spun into something special but I'd also be interested to see other designs. Anyone got any other ideas?

Well done again DS.

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

I've been working on something too

My idea

One big mistake, is that the width is 800 Shall I continue work on it? Use some other colours maybe? What do you say? I can give it more color, it's kinda "grey" now... ang give room for the logo at the top...

Here's the PSD... feel free to play with it

Softhead

[This message has been edited by Softhead (edited 12-02-2001).]

Emp: I would like to wait and see what other people do for ideas and what they say about them before I post a load of ideas, because its well more a the technical side that most of my designs will end up like. [Visual nice but a load of back end and front code for it to work].

So I will wait for others peoples input before jumping in .

[edit: softhead wow that is so centent rich , very nice but play with colours more]


Chris C

[This message has been edited by Darkshadow (edited 12-02-2001).]

Hmm, I'm not so sure if that feels modern or up-to-date to me, it looks more like one of those formualic "cool" sites that are so popular nowadays. For the record, both GN and Handson are *intended* as almost a cliché in design, the basic "top/bottom interface" sites. (As opposed to the "top/left sidebar/right content" cliché.) This is kind of cool, but still, just another cliché of sorts, seems I've seen the whole '45 degree angle' thing done somewhere else high-profile. (I'm not knocking it, I like clichés, things are typically done a certain way because they work!) Still, that said, I do like this design, are you thinking of floating windows here, or just a basic top interface and content living below? It's a good solid design that we could possibly work with, though I expect lots of feedbacks now that this topic is opened.

For the record, the grid I was thinking about is the grid in photoshop, grey block and white blocks, that thing that we all see so much of, as in this image... http://www.ozones.com/store/desktops/grid640x480.jpg - really, if anything says "Photoshop" better than this pattern, I don't know what it could be.

I do think we should discuss the whole layout 'thing', we have several issues to deal with here, a) it's got to be easy to implement in a database format, which means templates that are simple and make sense, and b) it's got to be able to display lots of rather big images - that *is* the whole point of this site! Whenever I get a site that's intended to be more about the content than the form, I go with simple designs, and if it's more about the design than anything else, then I go crazy, more is better. For this site I'd be totally happy with quick and easy navigations to the things of interest (ie: the matches), and a very clear and simple admin interface for the people playing matches, let them get their images up, add their comments, and off it goes.

So! I know I may have come off sounding a bit pissy about this - "old-fashioned", am I? Hrmph! ;-)

I've done a lot of big dynamic sites (under my more boring "IT Professional" guise, heh), and sometimes simple really is best. Sometimes it is not, so I don't want to stifle any of the creativity being shown here! Still, we keep jumping ahead of ourselves, we need a logo, yes, and we need a layout, but we also need a FEATURE SET, what is this site going to do? When we propose layouts here it's not just about the number of buttons, it's got to also address the concerns of the content that will need displaying - think bunches of images with text interspersed (I have a fast connection, so I'd prefer to have the option of displaying all the images on one page, which means it's gotta scroll, too! We could do a "next image", etc..., but that'd drive me crazy before too long and I'd see less cool stuff. We'll probably also have pages of comment on the matches, lots of text in tiny windows can get boring.

One of the best ideas that was proposed to me was the idea of using "photoshop style" pallettes for all the menu choices and navigation - these could be docked, minimized, or dragged wherever people would like. We could still allow scrolling, just add a simple DHTML control to let things float down the screen to where they should be after the scroll. This would give us a truly fluid design, we could even script it to launch a splash window (aka PS) that waits until the menus are loaded, then minimizes. Cookies (or some PHP variant) could be used to save your window layout for your next visit. I don't know if something like this would be considered 'modern', 'old' or 'derivative' (and truly, don't much care), I just think it'd be a cool thing to do that would also work with our content.

So! (again?) I like this first proposal, but still think we need to know more fully what features the site will have before going to far with this, do we have another forum? Or are those aspects just part of the matches? How will we view comments during the matches? (From both the players and the audience.) How will we display the images during the matches? What kind of layout will we use when we search for a specific game, ie: how will you display 45 search results? (<table>'s seem to spring to mind usually, heh.) We also have another interface set for the players during a match, what choices do they need, how does it work for them?

Heh, boring thoughts that always spring to my mind when beginning a big project, and friends, this is the biggest project that's ever been proposed here, make no mistake. I know you're all anxious to get right to work, but we need to have some sort of plan before we can judge designs properly.

Your pal, -doc-

softhead, i like yours a lot!
it's tight and elegant. maybe a tad buzy, but a really good start...

New fresh colours



Softhead

Hmmm...for some reason I can't connect to Darkshadow's link.

Never underestimate the creative powers of pure laziness.

Well said DOC, but I did ask for what content was going to be to give me a idea for a layout and emp give me some idea for it. I know all about the problems, technical side, browsers, speed, ect and all of that mounts up as more and more as ideas get added to it. So I thought I would get some ideas down as you would have read in the other post then wait and see what comes about of it, yes some of us are divining in and not thinking (shame on me) but I will wait and see what others say and think about all this PSpong idea, then I will help if needed.

I think the best thing to do is set up another forum to discuss about this then when it is do it can be removed, as the project would be well on its way. What do you think?

And you don't come off sounding a bit pissy about this - "old-fashioned", I was just saying my opinion about the styles and layouts of this and other sites linked with this one. It's just me being different and I love seeing different things on the web than being web normal (web normal being - "top/bottom left/top interfaces)

AppleCider: I don't think it you it's shity brinkster, try right cilck and then save target as.. and see if that works. If not try agian later .

Softheads idea re-coloured - Here

Chris C


[This message has been edited by Darkshadow (edited 12-02-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Darkshadow (edited 12-02-2001).]

"So! I know I may have come off sounding a bit pissy about this - "old-fashioned", am I? Hrmph! ;-)"

Oh no, as Darkshadow said this is just my taste - I think. Of course, sometimes simple is good - actually most time simple is the best solution. And I suppose we are jumping into this layout, but I ment it good man... I really did :-) No, really, I'm just trying to find out what style we're going for. My english not good, so I was thinkin maybe the best thing was to just show them what I was thinkin :-) This was done very fast, so it's not so very good planned - I'll think more about this, how it will be like with all the content and all that. And see what the others say, and see their proposals...

So people... lets plan this project, then do it! :-)

Softhead

I'm not really telling you guys to slow down, just trying to keep pounding home the point - think about how each design will work for all the different uses, many images with text between, or as a forum, or as a searchable thingie. Don't take anything I say as a slam, just advice from someone who's designed himself into a corner more than a few times, heh.

I don't know for certain what all the content will be in the end, but it will have those things as its focus, methinks. SH, I'm pretty impressed with the design you shot out, it's not easy to handle that much text content (something I do poorly), but I found myself picturing a more picture-oriented page, instead of text describing each match, maybe just bitty thumbnails of matches in play? (Think, "who's going to be writing that text for each match?") DS, that first design you posted looks like the concept might work with the Photoshop-oriented design concept I mentioned earlier? I'd love to hear more on how you were planning those little windows to function, like the DHTMLcentral windows, or as just a page layout device?

I'll have to sit down with my notebook and write some stuff out concerning what should be there, I don't think well when just typing like this, I forget what I said 12 lines back, so I tend to say it again! ;-)

Your pal, -doc-

Doc is making sense, there will most likely be A LOT of pictures on the site, possibly even more than text, (i doubt it, but for the sake of argument). Therefore, you will most likely need an open background without any borders, or something like that; something witha lot of space will probably be needed. I havent really thought about it much, but i will.

I dunno about you guys, but....

the domain name is pspong.com, but does that mean the site has to be called pspong? Why not PhotoShop Pong?

Doc: don't think that it is a big blow to are creatively, because it's not me and SH is just slowing down till more info comes about, then we will and any one else that?s has ideas can really get stuck into it then. Till more info come about I will wait and get ideas from what you said before and anyone else for that matter, to me more info the better .

And about the windows type thingy I don't really know how it would work as I just start drawing and them boxes came about so I just added them in. I was hoping more input on that one.

Guyo: some nice ideas there I hope more come about

Pugzly: yea I know what your saying about the name I just wanted a basic idea the logos, names, ect will change over the discussions on this PSpong site so I never really thought about it.


Chris C

http://www.angelfire.com/ny2/Milk/layout.html

Being one of the few amater designers here, I don't know how much influence I have in this, but thats what I thought off. Basically I just extended DS's idea. Sorry I can't find my login info so i can put this up on my other account (Doc, check your mail), so bear with the angelfire. Anyway heres how I broke it down.

1. Navigation. I don't think it calls for anything spectacular, basic images, rollovers if you will ... sure.
2. I think the logo DS made looks very nice.
3. The latest version of a random match going on at that time period
4. Links for the different stages of the match going on
5. Criticism. I figured we would use Weadah's lil toy
6. Random information ... matches, etc.

Sorry its late ... i dont feel like being chatty, you get the idea of what im saying though.


--------------
cheers.jay

Okey, I've been workin on something a little bit different today, based on what I did yesterday, and some new thoughts.

First it is the index
I like these colors. The navigation is easy. Basically the whole site is kind of simple now.

The we have the matches
User comments at the left, the match right...

What do you say guys? I think this will be a good solution, because it's almost the "top/left sidebar/right content" cliché we were talkin about yester day. It's just the first page that is not like that...

Softhead

~mutters about the young 'uns running aroung like they've just invented sex~

Some good work there people (I'll give a more detailled critique after I've got a few things done) why not think a bit more outside of the box, for example this is an impressive page which is pretty unconventional yet nicely functional:
www.halfproject.com

I'd prefer something a little more conventional but if anyone feels inspired to push the envelope (or any other cliche they fancy!!) then give it a shot.

I like the Docs idea about keeping things simple (we'll have to if we want things to be relatively 'automatic') - something like DS's idea but with the store downgraded to a link to 'extras' (it looks like running a full store might not be practical but we could have a few desktop backgrounds, mugs with logos and pos. the odd request put in). We could keep the user admin in one floating window and the current matches in another (pos. start with them minimised and docked with the main upper bar) leaving 'centre court' for bringing up the main content. A third window could appear on the match page giving details of the poll, comments, etc.

Although we are also discussing logos, colours, etc. perhaps (at least where it comes to colours) we could leave things customisable. The Doc has shown a great example of getting different looks swapping the stylesheets:
www.znippets.com/template

and we might want to think about something like that - if we use PHP to generate the CSS file we can allow the users to keep their customised details in their profile on MySQL. My thoughts are that we should try to keep the logo constant but we could use a range (I suspect we shouldn't throw all the 'branding' out of the window) or use one logo but in the spirit of PSPong we could offer the logo template to people who could then customise it and upload their own version.

Anyway I thought I'd just throw that into the mix feel free to ignore any/all of it - it was just a collection of thoughts I had (they don't really hang together as a whole).

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

I like Softhead's screen shots, but I'd shrink the bottom part of it (login, links, etc).

I gotta get a button done for RunningWolf as well. I need that at the bottom, if no one has any issues with that....

Yeah, Halfproject is great... but I'm not sure if thats what we're lookin for :-)

Hmm... everyone, critic!! We need critic to make this work. Take a good look at DS's proporsal. At mine proposals. At Jestah's... take a good look. What do you like, what do you not like. How do you think it should be like. Layout, navigation, colors. Everything? Critic!!

I really like DS' idea too. It could be great if we continue workin on it! The colors is nice, the whole design is light and not buzzy. The boxes could be worked on a little bit. The logo is okey, it's simple.. I like simple logos.

But about that photoshop-look idea. I'm not sure I like it too much. Don't kill me for being honest... it's too predictable I think. Haven't we seen things like that before? It's too "easy". An by the side, coudal already done something like that. If you take a look at 'previous matches and results'. i'm ready for something different. But of course, this is just my opinion. Everyone has the rigth for their own opinion... right?

So, what do I want to know from EVERYONE: What colors do you like? What do you like about the proposals? What do you not like? Give us more spesific critic on the proposals. And, Emps, I'm lookin forward to your critic :-)


Edit: Thanks Pugzly, I know about the bottom... agree with that...

Edit: Wrong link :-)

[This message has been edited by Softhead (edited 12-03-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Softhead (edited 12-03-2001).]

Softhead, love your design. One suggestion: The registration button should be at the top where people can see it right away, along with the login. Also, an "about"/ "new here?" link should be prominent. But this is a great start!

(Sorry if I seem picky about this stuff...my training is in User Interface design)

Never underestimate the creative powers of pure laziness.

[This message has been edited by AppleCider (edited 12-03-2001).]

SH: some nice ideas there, not so much content rich this time which is good .

I still think we need more people to get involved here and critic others work though. The more opinions we get, the better it can be.

I have more ideas and hope to get them done tonight and show you guys, then rip into it then.

Emp: "mutters about the young 'uns running around like they've just invented sex" what?s sex never heard of that word ?

Anyway, I know about halfproject and its good but not really we would like this to be (or is it?), I know a lot of sites that are great in the design world, but I would like to but different, if not some think fresh to this place. I get more ideas on screen including logo designs, but I will post the logos in the logo proposals post.



Chris C

Just popping my head in to say that I might have given people the wrong idea by mentioning halfproject - I was thinking that we should have something that looked like it (God forbid it is far to graphics heavy to fit the quick loading prerequisite!!) just that you could produce something unconventional which still works. I was just throwing ideas out to see what sticks and what doesn't. Personally I'd like to see something along the lines of the design DS gave - keep it simple and lean but throw in some nice DHTML features to make it 'special'. However, I'd also like to hear from more people on this.

DS: You 'kids' probably have some hip street term for sex (which I'm not 'down with'), like wickey or trumph, which is why the word seems so unfamiliar!!

Emps

Something important missing in all the designs so far...RULES. This is not FAQ, and should be completely separate (with a link to the FAQ from the rules page). That will be the FIRST thing new users will look for, after poking around (and sometimes before). Whatever they will be, they need to be prominent on the top level navbar.



Never underestimate the creative powers of pure laziness.

Emp: I was only missing about the sex you know but wickey or trumph sound good

AppleCider: You are right there is not rules page Hhmm I will think about that, But I think it would be nice to show the rules somewhere and show them again at the reg page so people know what there signing into.

well making a idea now that will hope include most ideas and what doc and emp said in the other post "Information Architecture and feature set, part I" see I will see what I get .



Chris C

OK my opinions on what we have so far:

I like DS's first go - the simple top (there is room for a rules button up there too) and the floating panels all have great potential and should hopeful spark off a few interesting lines of thought. Jestah's remix of the design with the grid background may be drawing the main court into a direction well worth pursuing although I'm unsure about the various panels - I think we should try and keep that area as clear as possible.

Next up was Softheads first go and I like his grey version and DS's recoloured one. I think the whole thing could do with being less busy but there are some elements (simple top, vertical text, the previous match outline with its thumbs, etc.) which work well. Now I think his second attempts are really getting towards something workable. You've simplified things nicely and you could easily see the current/previous matches and the comments section really working like that (keep it simple I think that is the thing). I think I'd like to see something with a more fixed central court like the DS/Jestah remix with Softheads panels working around (or over on the index) that. I think the elements on the match page are working very well indeed - colours, shapes, logo etc. are still up for discussion but I like the comments and centre court sections and that voting section down at the bottom is good. I suspect that a match like that would probably be too slow for dialup people although we could have a broadband/dialup setting in the personal preferences with dialup people getting thumbnails. The serve/comment, return/comment, etc. looks good.

There are definite elements from all the designs so far that work well. I like DS's top and panels, Jestah's centre court (although in grey!!) and SH's ideas on the way the panels should be laid out, and the simplicity of their content and the positioning of the voting.

I also like the PSPong like way you are sharing PSDs and remixing each others ideas and coming up with interesting variations. Very impressive work all round there - lets see some other ideas from other people and/or playing around with what has already been done.

DS: I knew (hoped!!) you were messing around there - but perhaps I've started something that might catch on (now all I need to do is get a skateboard!!).

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

Okey, I've been workin a little bit on DSs PSD.

First we have the first site, when the user/player is not logged in (or isn't registrated at all). Take a look here. You can all see what needs improvement or not. If you don't like these colours I can change them back to what DS started with. But shall I continue on this one?

Then it's when the player is logged in: here. About that flag thing. I suppose the player can pick their flagged players when they enter their "biography"...?

I was thinkin, when someone are searching for something, the searchresults took the at the right: current matches, rules, etc...

What do you say guys? Heh, I've been asking that for a few times noe :-)

Softhead

[This message has been edited by Softhead (edited 12-03-2001).]

Softhead: Good work. That is really just as I'd envisioned it - the flagged player links would take you to links to the match(es) the player was currently in and the flagged matches would link straight there. I'm not sure we need all those windows - I'd probably get rid of the rules one (that should really open in a separate page so it can be printed and put up in front of the monitor!!) and the search one (I'd keep the search features as part of the bottom of the user panel). Looking good on layout - any other ideas/comments? I'd still be interested if these panels were floating manipualtable panels - what do people think of that?

I also like the use of the colon to separate PS and Pong.

On the flagging front - it should be possible to have a 'flag this player' or 'flag this match' link/button which would update your profile to include the flagged player or match. It would be a bit like placing bookmarks in various places around the site.

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

Ok some things changed and some ideas from SH layout in this one, not much really to say as there is not much on it but I will work on this tomorrow and into the weekend to get more different ideas going and see what people say about them and so on

Here it is Not that great but better layed out I think.

I will upload the PSD file tomorrow as well so people can play around with it and see what they get.

Now sleep for me now .


Chris C

[This message has been edited by Darkshadow (edited 12-04-2001).]

Ok Maybe this isn't the best place for this but as far as layout vs logo I really like the rotating logos on GURU'S. I think variations of the same Font setup may be a good idea. Page is different every time.

[This message has been edited by Quarath (edited 12-04-2001).]

DS: Thats good - it helps to visualise what it looks like with content - I might expand the middle panel and have the most matches with the most recent returns in there with pos. most popular games (or something customisable) in the right hand column. I would try and cut down on the other windows although it is a good idea so don't get rid of them quite yet (could they pos. dock with the top bar when not needed or perhaps be part of the right panel?).

Softhead: I was also meaning to say that I like the way the bottom border truncates the bottom of the page giving the impression that the centre court is actually on the grid with the panels floating above it (and theoretically above the bottom) its interesting and we shouldn't ignore that kind of stacking in the ideas.

Quarath: No that kind of thing is well worth mentioning - I am quite interested to see if it is possible to have a big working site with customisable colours, graphics and logos (the first thing first year students do in the first computer class every year is to fiddle with the backgrounds and colours, sometimes resulting in vile combinations, so there must be a call for this) to demonstrate that web sites don't have to look identical in every browser but it may be a little experimental and spoil any kind of branding that was being planned. We'll see what people think - its a good idea though I know I quite like the different logos at GN!!

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

Emps: I'll try do what you mentioned later. Have some things to do first. I really liked those floting panels DS made, I will take a look at this later...

Softhead

People might also want to think about adding in a 'flag this player' (next to their name on each return) and 'flag this match' button/link. I wonder if each player should be encourgaed to also provide a little sig - say 100x50 or something or even a smaller icon thingy [insert creative ideas here].

I think Softhead is probably going down the right road with each match being represented (in the current/best matches panels) by a thumb of the last image, the names of the players and pos. the time/date of the last serve and the next person to serve. This should be nice and easy to do server side while still being informative and visually interesting (and easy to take in in one glance).

We still need plenty of input and ideas from more people so get your thinking hats on - this is your chance to get the features in that you'd like to see.

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

I've posted thumbnails of the current proposals at the www.PSpong.com site, I'll try and keep this updated as new ones come in. (Newest at the top for each entrant, hopefully.)

Your pal, -doc-

Doc: Excellent - could we have something similar for logos? Anyway we want to see more logos and more layout ideas - start from scratch or grab one of the PSDs posted above and try remixing it to show the way you think it should look.

Also we are still looking for further suggestions and critiques of things that have been posted - even if you think it is fairly minor/silly/unimportant. There haven't been many ideas about colours so what do you think? Also do you think we should go for a clear brand or make the look customisable?

[edit: Do you think that we should have little icons on the links - like a little book for the rules? I know I'd prefer more text based things to keep the number of graphics down but nothing is fixed at this stage]

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

[This message has been edited by Emperor (edited 12-04-2001).]

(oopes accidentially posted this twice. someone, delete this post :-) sorry, everyone)

[This message has been edited by Tyberius Prime (edited 12-04-2001).]

hmm. I like proposal No.1 from softhead currently best. But it doesn't fit on one screen. I know many pages don't but honestly, how often do you look beyond the first screen on a day to day basis?
So why not make a wider, but not as heigh layout? it would fit much better on a typical screen. (and yes, I've only got a 17" monitor.)

I'd suggest moving the golden rules either to the right side, or to a different page altogether. and put the top 10 games on a different page. put the currently best games to the right, where the top 10 games are right now. show only 7 volleys and games. that's the maximum number a human being can keep in its short term memory, and navigate easily.
oh, and I think it's missing a news section altogether, isn't it?
All of the above is just my personal oppinion. don't feel attacked. It's not meant as one. I couldn't do one as good as yours....

sincerly,

Tyberius Prime

hmmm...

TP: Good point on number of games that should be shown - I might actually go for something like only the top/most recent 5 (with a link to say the top 20 or so - or the worst 20!!).

I also think we should keep the panels trimmed down and simple (it helps for the server side stuff, inproves the speed of the download and doesn't overwhlem the user with information).

Emps


You're my wife now Dave

Yah, I still have to finish my proposal for the "Players" side of this site; the needs for a player are so much different from the needs of someone who's just here to "see cool pictures", it's almost an entirely diferent site! So, I am, no fooling, imagining two different sites here, the one for spectating, with the emphasis on watching things and going "ooh, ah!", and another that is all about finding matches, checking your rankings, modifying your public profiles, and playing the game. Spectators don't need all these links, so why complicate the experience for them? We can always have a link for players to "toggle" back and forth in their roles, and a different look on each site would be a good cue as to what your role is *right now*. Plus, picture the fun when a spectator upgrades to true "player" status, watch their faces when they finally get backstage! <g> Could be fun, and *will* make this an easier site to develop.

Your pal, -doc-