Topic awaiting preservation: French quotes.... (Page 1 of 2)

Ok, so they're about France, sue me.

P.S. (pre-scriptum in this case): I have nothing against France, I just thought these were worth passing on.....

"France has neither winter nor summer nor morals. Apart from these drawbacks it is a fine country. France has usually been governed by prostitutes."
---Mark Twain

"I would rather have a German division in front of me than a French one behind me.
--- General George S. Patton

"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion."
--Norman Schwartzkopf

"We can stand here like the French, or we can do something about it."
---- Marge Simpson

"As far as I'm concerned, war always means failure."
--- Jacques Chirac, President of France

"As far as France is concerned, you're right."
---Rush Limbaugh,

"The only time France wants us to go to war is when the German Army is sitting in Paris sipping coffee." ---
Regis Philbin

"The French are a smallish, monkey-looking bunch and not dressed any better, on average, than the citizens of Baltimore. True, you can sit outside in Paris and drink little cups of coffee, but why this is more stylish than sitting inside and drinking large glasses of whiskey I don't know."
--- P.J O'Rourke (1989)

"You know, the French remind me a little bit of an aging actress of the 1940s who was still trying to dine out on her looks but doesn't have the face for it."
---John McCain, U.S. Senator from Arizona

"You know why the French don't want to bomb Saddam Hussein? Because he hates America, he loves mistresses, and wears a beret. He is French, people." -
--- Conan O'Brien

"I don't know why people are surprised that France won't help us get Saddam out of Iraq. After all, France wouldn't help us get the Germans out of France!"
--Jay Leno

"The last time the French asked for 'more proof,' it came marching into Paris under a German flag."
-- David Letterman

:::krets.net:::

Sorry but I dont find it funny....its kinda plain stupid when countries make fun of each other ....in French they probably talk same shit about america as people do here about them.....

screw the politics

Oh Jesus H. Christ man, are you telling me you've never made fun of something?

It's satire my friend, that's all it is. Chill.

:::krets.net:::

Sure I did I made lotsa fun of Americans and Puerto Ricans

dont worry man its fine by me, I am not saying that you have done something bad, I just didnt find it funny, sorry

I agree. That is NOT funny. I won't answer each of those but... Many of those quotes are based on the useless force of France's army. So I wanted to add something that is alos worth mentionning. You know, while training for the war in Afghanistan, the French used to meet the Americans in simulators (simulating each force respective planes). And French always won. And also French special forces are one of the best on the world with the German ones. And French fries are better than freedom fries. And we have a lot of advance on US airplanes in term of AI and maniability. And I am running out of ideas. And do you think those quotes are really pointless ? Don't you think the problem is not the power of France's army, but WAR ? Don't you think the problem is linked to human nature ? I would have thought that would have been better questions. I have many quotes about wars in my head. And many come from your presidents Kennedy and Washington. They woul have been worther mentionning.

*sigh*

You probably think that Jonathan Swift was really suggesting that eating babies was a good end to famine too don't you?

:::krets.net:::

This is definitely not the type of sarcastic irony I can bear. Sorry if my sense of humour appears limited to you, but there are things that are not good joking with.

It is *very* limiting to not be able to laugh at oneself. In my experience, people or countries who can't laugh at themselves take themselves more seriously than they should. This just further supports the suspicion I have that you French tend to be arrogant.

I don't hear anyone around here all upset about the horrific things said about my president. In fact, I laugh at quite a few of the jokes about him and our country. I get upset when they start getting really bad but even then I don't get too worried because humor is a great way of easing tensions during conflict.

And besides, if these jokes are not funny, then why did my coffee come out of my nose?

[This message has been edited by Bugimus (edited 03-15-2003).]

This is just me Bugimus. I don't like those quotes, so I may be arrogant. As you wish. But please, please, please, don't generalize it to French. That hurts more than anything else.

i vote: not funny. it belittles the french underground and other patriots who fought the germans in defense of their country.. and what the french people did to the collaborators after the war.

it's equal imo, to belittling the polish for allowing the germans to overrun their country in a day(?) - without mentioning that the germans came in tanks and the polish army was on horseback.

I don't think the quotes are funny either (well... they are funny but they're also offensive) and belittle the French who in my opinion are doing the right thing.

I found them funny. And I suppose the discussion about the level of the average American's intellect was okay with you huh, Moon Shadow? I didn't see you defending the American's right to not be ridiculed, belittled, or generalized about. I understand that you didn't start, nor involve yourself with, those comments BUT, fair is fair.

I was irritated that those POV's came around, but that was someone elses comments made for humorous reasons. I can deal with that. It's the same thing here.

That being said... Yes, these quotes are in bad taste especially considering the issues at hand. These irritate me as much as the comments around here about America. That doesn't make them any less funny nor any less true (which is why some of the comments about America bother me so much, even when they are funny).

Thanx for the chuckles, Krets.

GrythusDraconis
"I'm sick of hearing that beauty is only skin-deep. That's deep enough. Who wants an adorable pancreas?" - Unknown

[This message has been edited by GrythusDraconis (edited 03-14-2003).]

Ruski himself said it, they're probably saying just as much trash about us over there as we are over here.
Doesn't change the fact that they were funny as hell.

"Going to war without France is like going deer hunting without your accordion."
--Norman Schwartzkopf

Poifect.

njuice42 Cell # 551
icq 957255

jejeje and shame on you krets

Jason

please, no comments about what we have done for them. yes, we helped europe and japan recover after wwII, but how long should we expect them to be grateful? forever? gratitude chaffs after a while, it's like a leash. (oh yissir, thanks for the help, er, how long will i have to kiss your a@@ for this?)

the only way to give is without expectation of return, otherwise it isn't a gift, but a loan - a tether.

That isn't even an issue, VR. I don't think France 'owes' the US anything and I don't think the Government (by and large) feels that way either. I think what is pissing everyone off is that France (and the UN for that matter) shows little to no interest in removing Saddam from power at all. If they did this would have been done when he broke the statute of the 1st Resolution. Now 17 Resolutions later we're voting on another one!?! That hardly seems like progress to me. Why should the US continue to patrol the no fly zones for everyone in the region. How about we take our planes and bases home and save some money? Lets see how long it takes the neighboring countries to start feeling uncomfortable.

Besides all of that - Whether all of those involved are doing this for the right reasons or not, it seems obvious to me that Saddam HAS to be removed from power. Why are the French opposing it so strongly if it is a necessary thing to do? If they don't want us (the US) to do it, fine. They need to get on the UN's ass to do it then. Quit opposing the US and start helping the UN. Pick a side, offer some options, don't just sit on your hands and stop everything and anything from happening.


GrythusDraconis
"I'm sick of hearing that beauty is only skin-deep. That's deep enough. Who wants an adorable pancreas?" - Unknown

Heh.

This is too much - so typical.

How many of these thing have been posted about America??

How many things have *you* personally said about America moonshadow?

But now that it is about france, it's bad?

Fuck that.

I find these quotes to all be 2 things:

1) Hillarious

2) TRUE.

Saw these posted on Shlonglor's site a few days ago. Pretty funny, especially the Conan O'Brien one.

They don't look all true to me, DL. Funny... sure. But a number of the comments are opinions rather than facts. Guess it depends on your views

I'm no stranger to picking on the French (I am Canadian after all) but the amount of hate blasted toward them lately is over the top, even for a cynic like me. Personally, I'd much rather pick on Bush.

Americans have different ways of saying things. They say 'elevator', we say 'lift'...they say 'President', we say 'stupid psychopathic git'....
- Alexi Sayle

I like that one, MW!! That was good!

LOL


GrythusDraconis
"I'm sick of hearing that beauty is only skin-deep. That's deep enough. Who wants an adorable pancreas?" - Unknown

Since when is joking around and letting of some steam such a crime? Making fun of the French does not mean they're hated. Please lighten up!

quote:

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Since when is joking around and letting of some steam such a crime? Making fun of the French does not mean they're hated. Please lighten up!

---

I didn't imply it was a crime, Bugimus and I'm really not bothered by krets post. I agree some of the quotes are slightly funny in that all american apple pie kinda way. I even laughed at one or two. I was just sticking up for the French as I agree with them. A few of us in this forum have conflicting views - no probs by me, makes things more interesting. I'm just sharing a different opinion, that's all

I don't really want to comment on the quote issue specifically, as that can be a very deep issue that I don't have time right this moment to go into... but this entire france vs. america thing seems very symptomatic of simple posturing.

I'm curious how many people who are actually blustering in america about freedom fries and france owing america somthing were even ALIVE during WWII... let alone involved. Americans seem to have this egocentric view of the world. It's amazing how many americans I talk to that just didn't realize there WAS terrorism in the world until 9/11. They just simply, honestly, didn't think about it. Were americans foaming at the mouth ready to go to war after the Sarin attacks in tokyo? What about the countless attrocities committed between the british and the IRA... or the continuing acts of horror in the middle east that AREN'T near the Bush, Inc. oil wells.

France may be passive to a fault at times, but America is the flipside. Something I find almost funny (almost) is the circular, hypocritial logic that dubya is trying to force down our throats. i.e. "France is wrong for not going along with us and upholding the UN solidarity, if you don't agree, We're going to go do this on our own no matter what the UN says". I honestly don't think he even sees the conflict in that logic. And I don't think most americans do either. We simply got a bloddy nose from a bad situation we created (and haven't learned from I might add) and we're pissed that not everyone is as worked up about our ego-centric blustering as we are. It makes me ashamed to even admit I'm american these days.

It's human nature to have a biased and short term memory of history. And sometimes that's a good thing (the current good relations with germany and japan are a good example of why we should let a grudge go). BUT, I think americans tend to take it to an extreme. They equate "things turned out well" with "we were right". And that is the fallacy. A lot of this, IMO, is that america is a VERY young country and still feels like it has something to prove. Mix that with having lots of resources and freedom almost to a fault at times, and you foster that kind of thinking very quickly.

As an american, I'm simply waiting to see if we're all still around in 2004 so we can start patching things up in the world.


It's only after we've lost everything...
That we're free to do anything...

I can't agree more Mindbender.

quote:

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How many things have *you* personally said about America moonshadow?

---

You know, I am not really happy to see that this is the most important thing you remembered from my posts. Yes I critiscized America... I critiscized in fact only America's behavior in the Iraq crisis. That's all. I didn't compared Saddam to Americans. I didn't compared America with such degratadory statements. And so on...

Those posts are not funny. First, they are full of prejuges that are absolutely false. If I expressed such prejuges, you would notify me really quickly that is not a good behavior... Those quotes also insult the memory of men that died for mankind, not only for France. Last of all, since they all are *so* funny, try to invert the situation.. And please, try to imagine this type of post concerning America in Vietnam. I don't think you would find this as funny.



[This message has been edited by Moon Shadow (edited 03-15-2003).]

MS - as I have said, there have been *countless* posts like this with america as the target.
And they have gone over with no issues.

But now that someone dares to say such things about another country, it's a big deal.

You're not happy that I remember that from your posts? Oh, so I should forget when insult america, but condemn someone when they insult france?

Typical. Very typical.

This is my favroite:

quote:

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"You know, the French remind me a little bit of an aging actress of the 1940s who was still trying to dine out on her looks but doesn't have the face for it."
---John McCain, U.S. Senator from Arizona

---

[This message has been edited by DL-44 (edited 03-15-2003).]

DL, I don't react because those quotes are criticizing France. I react because these quotes criticize French, French ideas and thoughts and also contain bad prejuges. I admit I (and other) criticized America... However, I don't remember treatening you like you had "no moral", "been governed by prostitutes" , "smallish, monkey-looking bunch and not dressed any better". I never criticized Americans. In fact, I always defended the difference between America and Americans. This is one of the most important thing to do nowadays. Even if it seems strange, America do not represent Americans. It represent the opinion of the persons that rule it. Maybe you forgot, this was surely not important compared to the other things we have to think everyday, but DL that was a point of my posts. Those quotes would not have angered me so much if they only treated France. You are free to criticize France. You are free to appreciate quotes doing do. But I find intolerable quotes making fun with dead persons, prejuging French, and even more intolerable people laughing with it. There is a just a belittling of mankind I can't support. If you don't want to recognize it, well, I won't kill you. That will just renforce my thoughts on mankind.

Homo homini lupus. -Plaute.
*sigh*

Here, have my soapbox too...one might not be enough

These quotes are all meant to describe behavior that people have found to be annoying over the years. That is all they are. They are observations and opinions of people about France and the French people. They are generalizations, they are meant to alleviate frustration, they are in fact funny.

I would venture to guess that the majority of these people quoted do *not* dislike the French in any serious way. In fact, I still like France, the French, and you too even though I find these jokes hilarious. For you to take them so personally reflects on your limitations and I would ask you to please not be so sensitive about criticism.

quote:

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If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself but to your own estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.

--Marcus Aurelius

---

. . : slicePuzzle

Not be so sensitive about criticism ? This is the problem Bugimus, this is not criticism, this is belittling and insulting (not all quotes). That's why I can't stand that. Nnot so many persons here seems to really see the difference. Anyway, I thank you for your consideration.

quote:

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Here, have my soapbox too...one might not be enough

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DL, what does it mean ? I don't understand.

Heh, I thought those were great I'd seen several before, but a few were new. Thanks krets.

My $0.02 on the rest of the comments...
Get over it! Maybe even grow up a bit. It doesn't matter where you live, somewhere people are going to be talking trash about you. Whether it's true or not, you have to learn to sit there and take it, because you do the same about other people/countries.

On that note
I'm not prejudiced, racist, sexist, or any other -ist... I hate everyone equally.

Yes, we see the difference. Do you see the similarity?

It's mostly jest, and what's not jest is opinion.

GET OVER IT.

Like I said, such things have been said about America over and over, and everyone expects that to be ok. And, it *is* ok.

But it's just as ok when we say it about someone else.

.

Explanation: when someone gets 'preachy' it is a common expression that they are 'standing on a soapbox'. So in otherwords, you are getting rather preachy and your position far exceeds your ability to back it up. An extra soapbox to stand on may help you out (that's sarcasm.).

Would you like to know what one of the issues I've always had with France is? On this kind of level, France has always had the mindset that it is ok to belittle the US, but the US is an opressor if they belittle the French.

Go figure...






[This message has been edited by DL-44 (edited 03-15-2003).]

i went to college that most around the US, and possibly the world due to an unfortunate incident a few years ago, have heard of. its called Texas A&M University. students and former students of the school are known as "Aggies" and are known for their rabid school spirit and pride; they're also stereotyped as stupid and ignorant and anything else negative you can think of. there's probably not a person in texas, oklahoma, or lousiana that hasn't heard an aggie joke making fun of these "qualities", and many other states with schools in the Big 12 conference like nebraska and colorado are also familiar with these jokes.

is Texas A&M a haven for stupidity? you can stereotype people anywhere, but considering it has one of the top engineering colleges in the nation, including top nuclear and aerospace engineering programs, is the only school to have land, sea, and space grants for research, and houses a presidental library (along with a host of other achievements and top programs) i'd say there's at least a few intelligent people that have attended the school.

my reaction when hearing an aggie joke (which happens almost without exception anytime an individual learns for the first time what school i attended) is a courteous smile and sometimes a real laugh when a stereotype mentioned is one i've seen portrayed in individuals i've known, and even something i've been guilty of myself on occasion. when we can't see the humor in our everyday lives, and especially in ourselves, the world becomes a lot more bitter place to live.

quote:

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Blessed is he who has learned to laugh at himself,
for he shall never cease to be entertained. - John Powell

---

chris


KAIROSinteractive

Everyone needs to take a deep breath and relax... on both sides.

First off... just because someone takes offense that you are belittling something they are a part of does not make them preachy or self ritious. I can't speak for specifics about people here because I haven't read enough posts to intantly put names to ideals. So I won't comment on specifics as it is outside my experience.

Secondly... just because someone says something in reflection of a groups activities, especially if trying to make light of a tense situation, does not make them prejudiced or hateful. This is the problem with political correctness. We've all gotten SO caught up in WHAT people are saying, we've forgotten to look at the intentions behind what they are saying.

Along those lines, there is a very real difference between stereotyping, prejudice, and bias. Stereotyping is an ingrained part of human psychology. It is how humans deal with an over-abundance of information. It has simply gotten mixed up with the wrong idea. People have forgotten the definition. A stereotype is simply making a generalization about an obervable groups behaviors based on common experience. e.g. if you get bit by a dog, you would then generalize that all dogs can bite you. This is a protective measure in your brain. It allows you to draw specific conclusions about general situations, it means you are trying to learn from experience. The problem is... people confuse it with prejudice and bias.

Prejudice is where things start to go wrong... this is when you take a stereotype and start to add things to it. You start to think..."That dog bit me... so all dogs can bite... therefore all dogs are vicious animals". You start to ascribe your OWN ideas which aren't based on experience.

Where this starts to get very bad is when we get to bias. Bias is when you start to ascribe personal emotions to situations. "That dog bit me... so all dogs can bite... therefore all dogs are vicious animals and should be killed." This is the kind of skewed logical situation that leads to violence and hatred. This is where humans start to show their bad side.

How does it relate? Well... if you accept that everyone makes stereotypes and it's normal healthy mental behavior and there isn't anything you could do anyway... you have to start looking for the difference between stereotypes and prejudice. Saying that "Black men are better at basketball" is a stereotype. And often it's true due to the physiological and social aspects of african american decent. Saying "Basketball is a nigger game" is a hateful and harmful prejudice. (I just loved growing up in a little country town *sigh*). This is where you need to take a step back and look at the intention behind what is being said and the mindset of the person saying it. Sometimes stereotypes are accurate generalizations, sometimes they come from benign ignorance, and sometimse they lead to malicious prejudices and bias.

Something I would add... DL, I know you are making a point and it may very well be a valid one. Again, I haven't been first hand witness to a lot of what goes on since I've hardly ventured outside the Photoshop area until recently (forgot we even had more threads hehe). But the only caveat I would bring up is that two wrongs don't make a right. Just because someone makes fun of someone else, or doesn't speak up in that instances, does not give full clearance to open up on them with both barrels. MS, from what I've seen, you are flying off the handle here more than usual. I don't really know for sure.

What I do know is that we should all strive to embrace the differences in life and learn from the views and actions of others... because the similarities are way too close. America was given a taste of how similar things can be to the rest of the world on 9/11.

$0.02

Anyway, here's your soapbox back DL... um... those coffee stains were on it when I got it...


It's only after we've lost everything...
That we're free to do anything...

Hmm hmm... I won't venture adding any reproach after this. You are all forgiven. But I hope I won't have to read again such things !

forgiven? gee thanks...

*whew*

And here I thought I was going to have to commit hari-kiri...

:::krets.net:::

[This message has been edited by krets (edited 03-16-2003).]

sheesh...

My guess is that if these quotes had made their way in here in about a year (or about a year ago) noone had really gotten upset about it.

Come on, I'll happily let you ridicule Sweden and the Swedes and laugh right along with you. Open season, let's hear it!!

(after all, you have to generalize a bit in order for them to be fun. My individuality is not that closely connected with my nationality, y'know..)

*sits down and waits for the bashing from any other Swedish inmates that might disagree with me*
(edit) And for the record; I thought they were funny(/edit)





[This message has been edited by Nimraw (edited 03-16-2003).]

Last night on Saturday Night Live, during their News skit, they said that since Americans were changing the names of French stuff, that the French were going to start calling American cheese - Idiot Cheese... I found it very funny, but it was one of those things that you had to see....

so see....we make fun of ourselves, as well as everyone else

__________________________
Cell 1007::SST

Thought that this was funny...



--

It may be a little hard to read since it was sized down, so here:

Bucky: So when I take my act on the road, I'll loosen the crowd up with a few French jokes. Everybody loves a good Frogism.

Rob: Bucky...

Bucky: How are a broken clock and a Frenchman who only speaks German alike?

Rob: Bucky...

Bucky: They're both right once in a while.

Rob: Bucky...

Satchel: HA HA! I thought you were gonna say neither of them take baths!