Topic awaiting preservation: Schwarzenegger Announces Calif. Gov. Bid

Schwarzenegger Announces Calif. Gov. Bid

Woohoo!!! Please please please let him win the recall election!!! I can't think of a better novelty to top off our utterly messed up situation here in California. Our current governor has so egregiously mangled our economy that I am in the mood for having Arnold come in if for nothing else just to put a smile on my face after such a mess.

. . : slicePuzzle

*sigh* you californians.....



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Cell 1007::

I can just imagine what you all think of us up there

we have a theory that if we all jump up and down at the same time, california will break off and float away...but it's hard getting the majority of Alaska, Washington, Idaho and Montana organized

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Cell 1007::

Lacuna: Remeber in the first Superman movie? Lex Luthor had a pretty cunning plan which didn't involve everyone jumping up and down at the same time

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Emps

FAQs: Emperor

Mangled the economy, Bugs? Isn't that what politicians do best?

considering how tolerant the california public is, this guy must have really screwed up!

Well, to be frank I don't think he would be worse than those crooked politicians, but not better either

What will be interesting to follow is his plans for the elections, and the number of people who will vote for him.

I read somewhere that if California was separated from the USA, it would become the 6th most powerful country in the world. I hope he understands well that and won't play with its economy.

[This message has been edited by Moon Shadow (edited 08-07-2003).]

This is probably a really bad idea for the Republican party. Although I completely disagree with the recall process, Republicans could run some well qualified candidates. Arnold's going to take time and money away from these serious candidates and ultimately blow it in the end.



Jestah

The east coast feels safer all of a sudden

I think I'd rather vote for Gary Coleman:
http://edition.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/08/06/candidate.coleman/

Although with Larry Flint and Leo Gallagher (is there a melon link running through things?) also in the race...........

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Emps

FAQs: Emperor

quote:

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Buel said he had no trouble getting the necessary 65 petition signatures from Independent voters in Alameda County, which he gathered at a recent Oakland A's baseball game.

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glad to see they have such strict requirements for those filing to run...

chris


KAIROSinteractive

Campaign fees = take 65 friends to ball game $7000.00
Miscellaneous history checks on competition = $10,000
Losing to the Terminator = Priceless

I mean, if you have to lose to someone wouldnt you want to lose to Arnold? I see no reason to think that Arnold will screw up. he seems to be very level headed and capable. Not to mention that he has the capability to bring his own money to the table. he's done it before on movies that have come up short on funding. I see no reason why he wouldn't in something as important as this.


[This message has been edited by GrythusDraconis (edited 08-07-2003).]

Bugs:

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I am in the mood for having Arnold come in if for nothing else just to put a smile on my face

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I always take the entertainment factor into consideration when voting. (not really but you know what I mean=) I figure once you elect a dictatorship, for whatever the term is, they pretty much do what they want... so during that time they should at least keep me amused and chuckling.

Arnold 'The terminator' V Jessie 'The Body' Scalpers would make millions.




[This message has been edited by NoJive (edited 08-07-2003).]

Gary "What ya' talking about Willis" Coleman has joined the
running also. Can't wait to see the debate between Arnold and Gary.




.quotes.

Only in California...

Actually there were a few noted actors that ran for office and did an ok job. If I remember correctly Eastwood was mayor of Monterey for a while. Sonny Bono was republican, was mayor in palm springs (..if I am wrong please correct me..) and was also a senator before he died. Then there was Jesse who was middle of the road in my opinion, though I did vote for him. Also, do not forget Reagan who was an actor, govoner of cali, senator and president for two terms. That is all that I recall at this point. Hell, I say give arnold a chance.

Sure he may not have the best image, depending on how you look at it, but what is the worst he could do? On the surface of his image, he has on the basic level lived the american dream. He came here an immigrant from austria legally, works a job that he likes to do, makes alot of money at it and his fame comes as a part of it. He has an ok family no matter how popular or unpopular some members of it is. The fact that him and his wife have been together this long is a miracle for most hollywood marriages. I think he is a decent guy, give him a chance.

And let's not forget the man from showbiz that became the most powerful man on Earth, Ronald Reagan. Of course, Arnie can't be the prez because he's Austrian-born, but you never know...

Hang on a minute folks. This race could be a whole lot tighter and more entertaining than you might think. Gallagher is also in the running. =)
http://gallaghersmash.com/


Make sure you hear the audio on the splash before entering.


[This message has been edited by NoJive (edited 08-08-2003).]

My only question at this point is - are any of you actually reading the posts up there^??

About 4 of you so far have announced what has already been announced futher up =)

(this report brought to you by the Repetitive Posting Police)

And hey, did you hear that Arnold Schwartzenegger is running for governer of California? Whoa!

Cell 1250 :: alanmacdougall.com :: Illustrator tips

<--- *lalalalala*


Yeah, it's in the news everyday here in Cal.

I'm getting sick of it. All it takes to get on the ballot is 65 signatures and a $3500 filing fee. Extra signatures lowers the filing fee, and vice versa.

Over 500 people have gone to pick up paperwork to run for office. Half of them are ordinary people. Ordinary people. Some guy I've never heard of was on the news, and he said his reason for running was, and I quote: "Hey, I think I'm just as good as the next guy." Depends on who the next guy is. And from what I'm hearing, it could be anyone.

Porn stars (who's that girl who drives a pink Corvette?), CEOs of porn magazines (Hustler CEO Larry Flynt), you name it, they're all running...

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Only in California...

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Damn straight.

hey .. we Califorians are alright!!! .. we can get shit done our own way .. fuck having to deal with a Gov that has his head so far up his ass .. we are trapped to strangle his unfortunate upon this states back

what the hell did I just write?


.::. cEll .::. 513

the only thing about this that bothers me is... the guy was voted in... by people who bothered to show up on voting day. correct me if i'm wrong (i know yall will) but the guy hasn't done anything criminal.. he's not snortin lines offa the desk, he's not got interns doing *extra* ....jobs...he's basically just a stupid shit and has really screwed stuff up. if that's the case... then i think he should stay in office til his term is up. if ya still don't like him elect someone else.
dunno...that's just my .02

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Cell 1007::

And for those interest in a more 'indepth' investigation can see the profile offered by rotten.com (warning there are pictures of Arnie's genitals and some nudity - nothing outrageous but...):
www.rotten.com/library/bio/entertainers/actors/arnold-schwarzenegger/

they announced it as:

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First in our penii-of-the-candidates series. Next: Arianna Huffington

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So before the ladies decide their votes on the other assets of the candidates wait until they focus on Gary Coleman

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Emps

FAQs: Emperor

quote:

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the only thing about this that bothers me is... the guy was voted in... by people who bothered to show up on voting day. correct me if i'm wrong (i know yall will) but the guy hasn't done anything criminal.. he's not snortin lines offa the desk, he's not got interns doing *extra* ....jobs...he's basically just a stupid shit and has really screwed stuff up. if that's the case... then i think he should stay in office til his term is up.

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But the recall election is part of the process. Just because someone is elected doesn't mean he is guaranteed a full term <cough> Nixon.

As for Arnold! Gimme a break! He's about as Republican as Colin Powell is! The only thing going for him is he's not a LAWYER.

Well let's just hope and pray that he doesn't start going the same way as the last Austrian who became a political leader in another country ....

While I agree with you, Lacuna, about us sticking with who we vote in, lobotomy is also correct. The recall option is written into our state constitution and is part of our process. Keep in mind that nearly every governor has had recall attempts made on his administration and this particular governor is the only one in California history to have gotten such a popular demand for his head on a platter.

I am so upset with Governor Davis that I want him damaged... personally, professionally, politically, etc. I would almost be willing to throw him into jail for a few years if that were part of the process. But of course much of that is my emotions speaking because he has done so much to hurt this state...

HOWEVER...

I would be remiss if I did not point out that we are a completely democrat controlled state. All the way up and down the political structure we are controlled by democrats. That means that Gray Davis is only part of the problem. Sure he signed all of this over spending into effect but how can we give the democrat legislators a pass? The entire democrat party in this state is to blame for this mess...

MOREOVER...

Why did the republican party run such a pathetic and feeble campaign when we had a chance to turn things around last election? How could that party, of which I am a member, be so incompetent to put up Bill Simon who by all accounts threw away the election with one mistake after another? I don't think there is any excuse for it and it shames me to admit I'm a republican because of it.

BUT HOLD THE PHONE...

Who decided that this state should be run by representatives hell bent on spending far faR fAR FAR FAAARR beyond our ability to pay giving us a $38 Billion defecit??? Who is ultimately responsible for who gets elected in this state? Who votes for bond measures election after election after election? The people of California. We deserve this mess because we asked for it. Part of me wants to see us crash and burn so we can realize how stupid we've been for believing the lies the people we elect shower us with. Power to the people? Sure, yes, of course... but God help us all when we actually get what we ask for

Rant complete now let me say a couple of things about our next Gov. He is not very conservative... he is not very experienced... he will not make all the pain go away... BUT he is bound to do a better job than Davis and he just might be able to oppose the democrat legislature enough to put a cap on some of this spending. In fact, I think it will be his celebrity and popularity that just might be what is needed to make that happen. I am very hopeful the more I hear about his campaign. He is getting some top notch advisors onto his team that will be able to help him make good economic decisions. I understand that the former LA mayor Dick Riordan, former Gov. Wilson, and Warren Buffet are backing up Arnold.

Has the election become a farce? Sure it has. But I plan on getting as much entertainment out of it as I can... after all, this is California

. . : slicePuzzle

[This message has been edited by Bugimus (edited 08-14-2003).]

"The recall, originating in Los Angeles in 1903 and later spreading to the state level and a few other states, is a device by which California voters can petition for a special election to remove any elected official (state or local only, not federal) before their term has expired."

Those who are against the recall and think Gov. Gray Davis, if he wins, should repeal the recall because "it's a bad idea" need to understand California government before they make any prejudices. In addition, the recall is not an impeachment. The recall is handled by the voters whereas impeachment involves power abuse and law-breaking. If convicted, the incumbent would be impeached by the legislatures. Essentially, impeachment is a removal with dishonor.

Mr. Schwarzenegger is a strong classic Republican pro-business candidate. His bull pen includes Warren Buffet, Milton Friedman, Steve Forbes, etc. I'm also tired of non-Californian columnists editorializing on Mr. Schwarzenegger and the California recall. Some of them have crazy notions like "California is turning into a third-world country," "California is the laughing stock of America," "Arnold is just a shoe-in," "the religious right do not want Arnold." I was at a picnic hosted by Congressman Randy "Duke" Cunninigham, a zealot for the religious right (more right-wing than Pres. Bush by a lot), the other day and he stated, "Arnold Schwarzenegger has my vote." He went on to say that Mr. Schwarzenegger is an intelligent man with some great ideas and like Pres. Bush said, "He would make a terrific governor."

I'm going to write an editorial on this issue and try to get it published by the WSJ's OpinionJournal. I'll be able to make a stronger case then.

By the way, Lacuna, the governor's most important job is to submit the state budget to the legislature every January and recommending certain expenditures and estimating revenues. When he did not submit the state budget, not only did he fail his most important and relatively easy job, but he denied his responsibilities as governor to exercise item veto power, to reduce or remove any item in the state appropriations bill. Basically, the governor was supposed to put together the state's financial program. Failure to do so resulted in big losses. Previously noted, a recall does not require the incumbent in question to have done anything illegal. An official can be recalled for nearly any reason even if the majority of constituents dislike the official.

The only people who can disengage the recall to keep the incumbent are the voters opposed to the recall. They need a majority vote against. Disengaging the recall will result in more damage than not disturbing it! Should the recall fail, the state is required to reimburse the official for expenses he incurred in his defense. Why is this a problem? It takes at least a million dollars to gather names and even more money to run a campaign.

[This message has been edited by metahuman (edited 08-14-2003).]

In case you missed it mark Monday Sept 22nd on the calendar.
Jay Leno has invited all 179 official candidates to be in the audience that night.
talk about the ultimate all-candidates meeting. No no...ultimate Gong show. =)



[This message has been edited by NoJive (edited 08-14-2003).]

Amazing. I wonder how many will actually show up.

Hell, there's more candidates than there are people that'll actually vote. It's rediculous, I tell you!

OK, one step closer to getting the Terminator elected... culling the herd

Bill Simon Drops Out of California Governor Race

We need a couple of more prominant Republicans to drop out and throw support behind Arnold to pull this off. If we don't then we're going to get $10 billion in new taxes accompanied by only $2 billion in spending cuts from Bustamante. Yikes!!!

. . : slicePuzzle

Just to clarify for metahuman - Impeachment does not in any way mean the removal of the person in question. That can result from an impeachment, but the impeachment itself is simply the accusation/investigation end of things.

C*****n was impeached. He was not removed from office.

He Who Must Not Be Named...

Just call him Clint0n, for Pete's sake. What is this fascination you Americans have with him, anyways?



[This message has been edited by Rameses Niblik the Third (edited 08-25-2003).]

for those of us who don't get to see this on tv, i thought i'd share with the rest of the group
Arnie For Gov. Commercial

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Cell 1007::

I suppose after Arnold wins we could call the election a Total Recall

GO ARNOLD!!!

1) How is Bustamante any different from Davis? The two have been in office together for the past five years, and I haven't once heard of Bustamante denouncing anything Davis has done.

2) I recently read that Arnold has signed up the teacher who was the inspiration for "Stand and Deliver" to come and advise him on education issues. The guy will be coming back to Bolivia to do it. Pretty cool. That's the point: Arnold seems to have some common sense and a circle of knowledgable people around him to help.

well Arnold certainly wont be the first "hollywood" in office .. good ol' Reagan .. I like Arnold .. I once saw him just strolling down 3rd Street Promenade in Santa Monica .. with his wife and an advisor I'm sure .. but he was just walking along .. saying hi hear and there .. this was like a year or two ago .. big guy with a big smile .. and friendly .. and the best part about him just walking along 3rd street was he wasn't being mobbed by people


.::. cEll .::. 513

Demolition Man rings a bell somewhere.

Damn you Taco Bell.

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Alevice's Media Library

Shame, shame, shame... Just when you thought it was safe to go back into the water... ...and what about his fathers affilliation with the Nazi party..? guess maybe these things obviously don't matter out 'there'...

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/08/29/1062050671604.html



[This message has been edited by Xpirex (edited 08-31-2003).]

For some reason that site linked to shuts IE down everytime I visit so (at least until it gets archived) here is the link to the actual article:

[WARNING: Sexual explicit talk ahead:]

www.thesmokinggun.com/doc_o_day/doc_o_day.html

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Emps

FAQs: Emperor

Pfft. So, the guy smoked some weed and banged a few people?

that's a bad thing?

Exactly...after all...JFK did exactly those kinds of things...so did clint0n for that matter...and both of them made president.

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...and what about his fathers affilliation with the Nazi party..? guess maybe these things obviously don't matter out 'there'...

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So, how many generations have to pass in Arnold's family before one of them can run for public office? Should Arnold be punished because his father was a Nazi? I'd like to see the rationale for that one...

So what? So what?... it's just indicative of the decline of moral and ethical standards thats all. 'A people gets the leader it deserves' someone said somewhere.

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How did a nation which founded itself upon high principles of rectitude and virtuousness come to such a pass that the President of the United States could engage in sexual perversity in the Oval Office and then perjure himself regarding it? How could the nation reach such a point that many citizens would not only tolerate such behavior, but defend it?

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...the reactions above say so much about you...

http://www.bigeye.com/jjwint01.htm

http://www.academia.org/store/sex_politics_morality.html


[This message has been edited by Xpirex (edited 09-02-2003).]

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it's just indicative of the decline of moral and ethical standards thats all

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And tell me xpi, when was this imaginary time in which society had high moral and ethical standards?

I'm always stunned by this seemingly common perception that life prior to this time was somehow more meaningful, more moral, more free, a modern camelot.
You need some serious history lessons I'd say.


What leaders have there been - of *any* nation - who have been truly moral and ethical?

What leaders have *not* had - in their past or present - some events which would be frowned upon?

And again - what the hell difference does it make if a might-be-governer smoked a little weed and slept around?

[This message has been edited by DL-44 (edited 09-02-2003).]

Yeh, your absolutely right DL-44, thinking about it there never was a time... but people used to pretend there was at least or feel shame about certain things or attempt to hide such things.. or at least strive for something... now they don't even seem to care... But there is a definate change you have to admit.

Yes, there used to be a lot more people who would vehmently condemn in public the actions they participated in privately, and persecute other people for their own sins.

That's what you'd rather have?

I would prefer to have a leader that was virtuous AND implemented good public policy.

If I can't have that, then I will place the priority on good public policy over personal virtue. What the leader does in his private life is his/her business but their job number one is about putting in good public policy.

In this case, we are talking about actions done many years ago. Who doesn't have things in their past that they're ashamed of now? These are humans we're electing, not saints.

I was not one of the people who wanted to crucify C*****n for his past sins OR for his private escapades in the White House, just in case anyone is thinking of accusing me of that. I know many of my fellow Republicans were and I disagreed with them at the time as well as now.

. . : slicePuzzle

Call me an idealist or a romantic but I believe in virtue and goodness too... and believe it or not I do know some extremely virtous people...but by their very nature they do not seek postions of power. What did Aldous Huxley say?: 'Power corrupts.. and absolute power corrupts absolutely'



[This message has been edited by Xpirex (edited 09-02-2003).]

So then, doesn't your statement there pretty much preclude the possibility of "virtuous" people running for public office? And contradict your objection?

And again, I have to ask, what is wrong with what was posted in that article?

He smoked some weed.....had some sex.....

Many of our current leaders do far worse things by the policy they make and support every day.

Call me a realist then because I believe part of true virtue is not allowing idealism to obstruct the helping of others. In this case, Arnold is the *only* real chance we have of improving our condition here in California (the other PRC). He is not a pure conservative, he's not without blemish, but he will be in a position to at least turn this state in the right direction. How far can he actually get when opposed by the legislature remains to be seen but I would like him to have the chance.

It's really quite simple at this point. There are only 3 real choices. Davis, Bustamante, or Schwarzenegger. The first two are identical except Cruz is not as corrupt. So we really come down to 2 choices, Davis/Bustamante or Schwarzenegger. Bustamante has already published his plan and it is exactly what Davis proposes... huge tax increases and virtually no spending cuts... in other words keep doing what we've been doing.

Arnold, on the other hand, is viewing tax increases as the last resort and is looking to do some serious cuts in our spending. That is the only way out of this mess and if the people of this state don't want it, then we deserve our continued downfall.

. . : slicePuzzle

[This message has been edited by Bugimus (edited 09-02-2003).]

Actually I have to disagree decreased spending at this point by the governement would be bad for an already depressed economy.

While on the surface it make sense anyone who's studied and believes in Keynesian economic theory (I do) will tell you that less governement spending is bad for the economy.



.:[ Never resist a perfect moment ]:.

[This message has been edited by bitdamaged (edited 09-03-2003).]

I didn't think states could get away with that kind of thing though. The federal government can do that because it can always just forgive its own debt or print more money but do states have that ability? I'm not totally sure how that works actually.

I used to be a big believer in Keynesian economics, bit. I'm afraid I've gone over to the dark side since then though

So how do you plan to vote, bit? We've got just over a month to decide. At this point I'm totally supporting Arnold... unless some totally disastrous revelation comes to light and in politics you never can tell.

. . : slicePuzzle

Honestly as far left as I lean, there's a lot about Arnold that I can get behind. On most social issues he's pretty liberal, to the point where sometimes I wonder why he even declares himself republican in the first place.

That being said, while even though he's got Warren Buffet (who I admire greatly) I can't really get behind his economic plan which is still the basic republican "less taxes, less services". Considering his views on a lot of the social issues this comes as hollow to me because it almost seems Arnold is republican for financial reasons only, not to mention he has virtually no political experience and this whole campaign smacks of his own ego.

Now between Davis and Cruz, that's a tough call, really I've been against the whole recall since the start (It's just made any difficulties worse) and though I would like to just vote no to the recall as a whole I'm thinking it might be safer to toss my vote to Bustamante who only needs a plurality of the "Yes" to the recall votes.



.:[ Never resist a perfect moment ]:.

Please tell me if you think our massive deficit is a problem at all. I used to believe that major debt was a *good* thing, in a Keynesian sense. If you think it's not a problem at all, then I can completely understand why you're ok with Davis. But if you think it is a problem, how can more spending help?

[edit] I better rephrase that... I guess you would say more spending with stimulate the economy. But would you support massive tax increases to the tune of $8 billion as Bustamante proposes?

[This message has been edited by Bugimus (edited 09-03-2003).]

Facing political resistance, Estrada withdraws as judicial nominee

This is an example of the kind of nonsense that is propelling efforts like the Recall. For two years, this nomination has waited to be voted upon. Why has it been two years? Because the Democrats didn't want to vote on it. They didn't want to vote 'yes' because Estrada was a Republican. They didn't want to vote 'no' because they didn't want to alienate Latino voters. So they left it where it was. They were afraid that Estrada couldn't possibly be objective as a judge and that Latino voters were too thin-skinned and would feel slighted if a Latino nominee was voted down. They and their Republican counterparts really do think we're all idiots that have to be led about by the hand.

If it ever was, politics is no longer a meeting of the minds to determine what is best for the nation. It has fallen into doing everything you can to trip up the 'other side', even at the expense of the nation. The United States has been one Federal judge short for two years because of these kinds of games. This is why people say nothing ever gets done, and why voter apathy is at an all-time high. It's the same thing with the Texas State Senate. The Democrats ran away in order to prevent the Republicans from redistricting them out of existence. The Republicans want them to come back and take it like Texans. It's all a game to these people, who still insist on acting like they know better than we do how to run things.

I think a lot of these people are very nervous about the Recall. If it succeeds, any one of them could be next...

That's enough of that rant for now.

Well said, Wangenstein. I think the politicians should be nervous. It is about time they start being held accountable for the jobs they do (or don't do for that matter). If this recall election in California sets a precedent, then so be it: maybe it will get people to think twice about making promises they don't intend to keep or keep them from making ones it is impossible for them to keep. With regards to the Estrada incident: this is classic politics in D.C. and it simply has to stop.

<enter idealist> Personally, I think the party system should be abolished. I feel that party politics are one of the biggest hurdles to getting anything accomplished in the US government. How can anything be sensibly accomplished when a bill sits on the table for months (or years) because one party simply doesn't want the other to win? The bill can't pass on its own merits. The backscratchers have their day and the fence-sitter's play their game - time passes and nothing gets done. I think it is absolutely inexcuseable that these people can get away with such childish behavior - and it absolutely amazes me that they somehow managed to get voted into office again.<exit idealist>

I understand that party guidelines and stances can help voters in their decisions. I've known people who have only voted for one party in all the elections they've ever voted in simply because they knew what the party stood for and assumed the same of the candidate. If there is one of those people out there, you can be assured there are plenty more. That's what the parties count on. Who wants voters to actually think about the choice of candidate? If candidates were forced to stand on their own merits, and truly say what they stood for, I think we would also have much more intelligent voters. People would have to listen and learn and research instead of counting on a general "close enough" guideline. <I thought I told that idealist to shoo>

At any rate, I wish Arnold the best. If I were Californian, I'd vote for him.

New Poll: Yes On Recall, Yes On Arnold
Of course, polling data always has to be taken with a grain of salt but I like these numbers This is such a lightning campaign. I mean, the election is next Tuesday already.

. . : slicePuzzle

I can't wait! I, for one, am going to vote the hell out of Davis!

who's arnold schwartzernagger? crazy germans. i'm going back to sleep.

Eh... with one week left in the race, Arnold is actually leading in the polls, and by a 15% margin

I can't vote, but this is entertaining nonetheless.

Polls can be very unreliable at times. But even the polls that are left leaning are showing Arnold in the lead. That is a very good sign... *if* you want him elected that is I can't wait to see him terminate the *tripling* of our car tax.

. . : slicePuzzle

I'm very pessimistic when it comes to people who actually want to be politicians. If you're waiting for him to abolish the previously noted tax...I think tha'ts exactly what you'll be doing...waiting, and waiting, and waiting....

If he wins, we will know very soon. One thing is clear Davis/Bustamante have both pledged to *raise* taxes. I would rather go with the guy who hasn't taken that pledge because at least there is the possibility he'll stick to it. If I thought he could really win, I would prefer McC*****ck be elected because I agree far more with him than Arnold on most issues.

. . : slicePuzzle

The problem with McC*****ck (besides the issues on which we differ) is that, as a far right-winger (compared to the state in general), he has almost no chance of getting elected to a statewide office in California. The Republican Party, however, insists on sending very conservative Republican candidates to the slaughter. (Remember Bill Simon? Richard Riordan could have won the whole election, and then we wouldn't be in this mess, interesting though it is...)

ow: http://www.alternet.org/story.html?StoryID=16902

Jason

JKMabry: Damn I was just going to post that - thats harsh (and lurid) criticism - how much of it is true though?

___________________
Emps

The Emperor dot org

Interesting how all this is popping up, just a few days before the election...

This is politics folks, aint it cool? ~puke~

Arnold treats women poorly and was in bed with Enron folks.

Bustamante refuses to denounce a racist slogan of an organization he supports and uses illegal monies for his TV ads.

Davis is a class one crook and a hypocrite to boot for not coming clean with the allegations of being extremely abusive to women on his staff.

The LA Times runs the allegations against Arnold but refused to do the same when Davis was running, but then that's what we expect from the Times.

So everyone is less than what any of us would want for our elected officials and it all comes back to what policies each one supports and how that squares with those of us who will be voting on Tuesday.

. . : slicePuzzle

Bugs: Well I'm sure a lot of them are as bad as each other but this most recent revelation would mean that Arnie isn't your best choice if you want any kind of resolution to your energy crisis.

___________________
Emps

The Emperor dot org

Our energy crisis is fundamentally rooted in NIMBY (not in my backyard). We have energy consumption needs and we don't have enough power plants to handle it. We need to build more but no one wants them anywhere near where they live.

Besides, the problem we are facing now is a fiscal problem. Our energy crisis has somewhat subsided for now. Arnold will do much better with the economy than Davis/Bustamante will. That is why he has my vote because he will look to limit spending and stimulate economic growth. I believe that is what will get us out of this problem and Davis/Bustamante have both stated what they would do to fix things and it is completely the opposite of what I believe we need right now.

. . : slicePuzzle

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This is politics folks, aint it cool? ~puke~

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In the face of that kind of reality you seem to remain an eternal optimist, I admire that.

In the end I normally vote for the lesser of the 2 evils myelf and try to be optimistic. Glad I don't live in California and have to choose the lesser of 135 evils =\

Jason

Bugs:

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We have energy consumption needs and we don't have enough power plants to handle it. We need to build more but no one wants them anywhere near where they live.

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Does energy efficiency not enter the debate?

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Emps

The Emperor dot org

Yes, of course it does! But that requires *new* and more efficient plants to be built. Governor Davis has restarted plants that had been shut down because of their gross polluting in an effort to keep up with our growing needs. Believe me, simply being more energy efficient is not enough to meet the demands of the future. The bottom line is that we need *new* plants and no one wants one anywhere near their house. That must change and we need a governor with enough forsight to build for our future.

Unfortunately, that man is Tom McC*****ck but we've been over that point before I can only hope that Arnold brings Tom into his inner circle so he can help out.

I should point out that there are those in this area who have installed alternate energy sources in their homes. If you drive down any middle class neighborhood, you'll notice solar panels here and there and water heating pads on the roofs. But my understanding is that these are very expensive and what's more relevant, they are very ineffective. The alternate energy sources for the home are just not cost effective enough to make a dent.

But here is some good news, we do have several places where we can build new hydroelectric plants. Tom McC*****ck has a plan to rebuild California's infrastructure over the next several years and hydro-electric as well as wind generated power is on the list. Here again however there are problems and this time it comes from the very people who usually like alternate energy. The environmental groups generally oppose hydro-electric because it causes habitat alterations for our little creature friends. So you're damned if you do and damned if you don't on some of this... sigh

. . : slicePuzzle

Bugs:

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Yes, of course it does! But that requires *new* and more efficient plants to be built.

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LOL - I meant at the users end

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Emps

The Emperor dot org

I think the commercial that states, "When all the laughs are over...California will have to live with the outcome." is a good point, there shouldn't be a recall but Gray Davis has screwed us royally. Triple DMV Frees? Wtf, I'm not paying $1500 to register my vehicle. (2004 Toyota Tacoma)

Through Davis' mistakes we, the Californians, are paying the price. I really don't think anyone that doesn't live in California and is going through this has much room to say whether or not they think So and So would be good govenor or whether there should be a recall at all. The point is, Davis screwed up and we're paying the price.

Personally, if I was able to vote, I would vote Yes on the Recall, and most likely for Arnold, not because of his Hollywood Status, but because I feel he knows what he is getting into and that he will be able to handle the job and if, in the end, he turns out to be no better, or worse than Gray Davis, then that is what we'll have to live with.

Yep, I voted!

I'm really surprised that Arnold didn't offer McC*****ck a place in his inner circle earlier on. This way, he could make a smooth transition from competition to cooperation, and Arnold's victory would never have been in question.

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Through Davis' mistakes we, the Californians, are paying the price. I really don't think anyone that doesn't live in California and is going through this has much room to say whether or not they think So and So would be good govenor or whether there should be a recall at all. The point is, Davis screwed up and we're paying the price.

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do you not realize that a bit of what goes on in california affect the rest of the pacific northwest (and further i'm sure). that loverly lil energy crisis yall got goin down there has jacked power prices in montana, washington, oregon and idaho. it's not the only thing mind you...but it's one of them! the port in l.a. is the busiest port in the u.s. so if that's not moving how it should, then business in other states suffer. i could go on and on with this, but i think you get the point.
believe me...i'd love nothing more then to set your whole state afloat...but since i can't, yous hafta deal with people having an opinion on what's goin on there!

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Cell 1007::

[This message has been edited by Lacuna (edited 10-08-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Lacuna (edited 10-08-2003).]

Snookumz: I haven't worked out why you think we shouldn't have an opinion on this (the goings on in one of the most important states in one of the most important countries in the world - the 'one of' bit is optional). OK so one guy has made a mess what you need to think about is whether the person you are rooting for will be better or worse.

An interesting article:
www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,1057412,00.html

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Emps

The Emperor dot org

I think you all should voice your opinion about our fiasco out here. In fact, I think it would be fun to hear how each of you non-Californians would vote.

So yes/no on the recall.

And who would you vote for in case the recall makes it?

. . : slicePuzzle

Well, first explain this 'recall' to me...what is it exactly? What does it mean in the american politcal system?

No to the recall as it was all dirty dealings from the power companies.

Who would I vote for amongst that sack full of liars and cheaters? Now there is a pickle indeed. Was Gary Coleman still in the race?

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Emps

The Emperor dot org

Haha, Gray Davis has been Terminated!

Finally, proof that the system *can* work. So many times we get screwed by politicians, it's amazing to finally see a system that says "you fuck it up, and you're gone." Congratulations to all the good people of California, hopefully everyones lives will be better for it. This should be implemented in every government, at every level. This is the ultimate way to force governments to be accountable to the people.

Bugs, Yes on recall, thumbs up for Arnold (he may not of been my top choice, but the race was between him and the word 'no', voting for anyone else [except Davis - 'no'] would hurt the entire recall vote).

Skaarjj, the recall is a vote brought on by the people, because they felt (accurately) that their governer was doing a piss-poor job. What the special vote does is forces out the old governer before his official term is up, so that he can do no more damage.

Give it up for Governer Ahhhhhnold!!

Yes, he won. Seriously. Ozone thread.

in austria (my home) the newspapers wrote already yesterday that Arnold is governor. They are very hasty!

And accurate!!! Woohoo!!!

I am thrilled that we have a second chance at this! Now it is time to see the recall delayed for months because of all the legal challenges that have already been prepared by the opposition. I can only hope that the courts quickly decide that the people have a right to be heard.

Emps, please don't judge the entire process by that one article. I really don't think that is fair at all. The people of "kullyforya" wanted this to happen. It couldn't have happened without a whole lot of signatures and ultimately a whole lot of votes for the recall and for Arnold. I went to the polls this evening and I have never seen such a turn out before. There was a line around the building! A friend of mine had the same experience and he voted at this lunch hour. Turn out was huge and I think Arnold really has the people optimistic about our future once again.

Anyway, I am just euphoric about this. Now I'm off to watch more of the analysis and such on TV. Good night all

. . : slicePuzzle

Like it or not, know it or not... it's the start of a new day for California, and hopefully the end of a long night.

Bugs, I share your euphoria...