Topic awaiting preservation: Screen/Gradients?

I 'possibly' have a newspaper ad to create and need to know if someone can explain how a 'screen' in a newspaper ad can be equated to a 'gradient' in both a vector program and in Photoshop.

The newspaper is not exactly high end printing at 85 LPI and I've been told that to be safe I should not go much above a 20 percent screen for any gradients I might use. Does this mean I can create the gradient in say PS and simply drop it to 20%?

The newspaper also prefers PDF files but that's kinda out of the question for me so because it will likely be grey scale, one spot colour at best... I'm thinking a GIF file might be appropriate. Yes/No?

Then... and I'm probably waaaay off the mark here... if I wanted to run off a few samples on my cheap and sleazy printer what DPI should I use to best show what the ad might look like in the paper?

Oh.... the newspaper uses Mac's.

Hope I made sense. =) Thanks for what comes back.

Screens at the proper resolution in PS are really no different then those in a vector program - qualitywise. In a pixel program, it's made of pixels and sometimes it helps to add a little noise, do a guassian blur, etc. Gradients can band (this is when you see strips of color instead of a smooth transition) badly at times, and ones created in a vector program can be extremely problematic (from my experience). Either way, ever RIP, output device, line screen, etc. is different and sometimes it just takes a little trial and error. You can always ask to see a proof from the people creating the film for the ad. That will be your best representation.

I'm not versed in Newspaper as a medium BUT, I think the reason they are probably telling you not to go darker then 20% is because of the Dot Gain thats experienced on newsprint. Dot gain is when the dot from the printing plate hits the newsprint and bleeds. The higher the screen, the closer the dots are together, hence stuff will start to look mottled and nasty.

Why is pdf out of the question? Gif is not acceptable btw.
If you're working in PS, your file resolution should be around 180 ppi. Outputting that file to your printer will be perfectly fine, but yeah, newsprint isn't as white or pretty as the paper in your printer, so it won't look exactly the same.

Hope that helped a little.

Thanks Jen =) Helps a whole bunch and makes sense in what's left of my tiny little mind.

Can't do the pdf, cuz duzn't have the adobe program required. Have the reader but not the creator...which I understand is worth a chunk of change.

Thanks again.

You can save as a pdf from PS or Illustrator!

"I've been told that to be safe I should not go much above a 20 percent screen for any gradients I might use." Who told you this? The newspaper? I think it's possible there is some confusion in the term "screen". When applied to offset printing, the term line screen refers to how many halftone dots there are per linear unit: for instance, "dots per inch" if you use inches. That use of "screen" has nothing to do with tonal values in the image. I'd be careful with gradients - the newspaper dots are too coarse to render gradients with much subtlty.

The key setting for you is going to be the dot gain setting. Try maybe 20%? I'm no expert here - Jeni or jstuartj probably have better advice. It's sort of a crap shoot anyway. And as Jeni points out, recent versions of Photoshop can save images in PDF format - you don't need Acrobat. If that's not an option for some reason, EPS or TIFF would be far better choices than GIF. TIFF and EPS both have platform-specific options, so be sure to choose the Mac options if they are a Mac shop.

Finally - I suspect even a "cheap and sleezy" ink jet printer will handle images diferently than newspaper, if for no other reason than the lack of dots. Something like an older 300 dpi laser printer might come closer, but even that doesn't suffer from dot gain like a newspaper press. This post doesn't sound very helpful. Sorry.

Jeni, is correct. They are suggesting that your gradient should read no more then 20% most likely to prevent problems with dot gain. My guess that since midtone dots 30-75% gain more then other tones it's safest to produce your gradents below the midtone level. There for you will not get odd banding effects.

The printing industry mostly uses the following formats; TIFF, EPS, DCS 1 or 2 (A special kind of eps), and PDF. Some higher end workflows use Scitex LW/CT and TIFF-IT. You should avoid JPEG, PICT, BMP, WMF, and GIF.

If you are unsure, I would call the CSR at the paper and ask to talk to a Prepress Tech/Manager. They will be able to best suggest and alternet workflow, it's in there intrest as it also waste there time if something goes wrong. A good printer or publisher should also beable to provide a spec sheet, that lists there perfered setting and formats.

Illustrator and Photoshop generate PDF, should work but some options could cause issues on older equipment, Transparencey seems to be the bigest issue. Again to ask the printer as their workflow can limit you options.

One could use Illustrator 10 and save as a PDF. The setting will vary with each printer you will need to ask what to setting they perfer.

!!!! The most important thing is to embed all fonts, or convert all fonts to outlines prior to creating the final PDF for deliverly this will pervent missing font problems. The only issues maybe smaller type my gain weight slightly so it may not always be possiable. You may also need to provide the fonts, and I would avoid True Type fonts (or convert them to outlines) but you will need to ask if they are acceptable or not. !!!!

You could also create a PDF in Photoshop 6 or 7. It should work fine, I must confess I have never tried one direct from photoshop? I would keep all copy in "Type Layers" and choose Embed all vector data, using either embed font or outline fonts. Turn off save transpareny, Turn off image interpolation, and use zip compression. Use of profiles will depend on the printer.


J. Stuart J.


[This message has been edited by jstuartj (edited 06-03-2003).]

Thanx folks. Made my life easier. The person at the paper I was talking with had me a bit confused (very easy task) when he said: "What you call a gradient - - we call a screen." Then he went on to the percentage bit.
Thanks

=)

Very helpful and interesting. I should take the time to learn how to add things to the FAQ

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Working in a printshop i have to agree with Jeni and JstuartJ. The best thing you could do to make printers (usiing press or HQ digital printers) happy is creating an .pdf with all the font-types included and the images in a high enough (150 -300 dpi) resolution. Also read and reread the te text's to find (stupid)mistakes and typo's. Finally check the colors and the positioning from everything. Then send the pdf to the printer. Why all this checking you ask? I is not easy (without the right plugins nearly impossible) to change much in a .pdf file. You can make changes better with the original program.
If you don't have Adobe Acrobat or Distiller you can always use the online .pdf creator from adobe....

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