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Ducati
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: in your head
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted posted 10-31-2002 09:20

Think again...

I just registered on Comstock and read their stuff before registration.... this is pretty interesting.

PIRACY
You cannot use copyrighted images
without permission. Period.

OR ELSE...

Please understand the spirit in which the following information is given: Long experience tells us that our customers are completely scrupulous about adhering to the copyright conventions, and we make no assumptions to the contrary. This info is for newcomers and folks who may not understand the implications of these issues.


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Incredibly painful
Mistake #1
Thinking that the worst thing that can happen to you if you "steal" an image is that you can be forced to pay what you would have had to pay anyway...


Think again. Copyright laws provide for statutory penalties of up to $150,000 per infringement. "Borrow" a picture that you should have paid $29 for? Who's gonna know, right? Somebody "catches" you, you pony up the $29 bucks, right? Nope. You have "infringed" a legal copyright, and THAT's what they're going to come after you for: $150,000.


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Incredibly painful
Mistake #2
Thinking, hey, let THEM prove I DIDN'T pay for the picture.


"Intellectual Property" issues are different from a lot of things in the rest of the world. ("Intellectual Property" is how the law describes things like books, poems, symphonies and...photos.) In the rest of the world, if somebody thinks you stole something, they have to prove you did. In the world of "copyright infringement", you have to prove that you DIDN'T. Yep.

Let's say, for example, that someone sees one of their pictures used on your website. They can prove that it is, indeed, their picture. They own the copyright on it. They can make a demand that you prove that you have legally acquired the right to use the picture. If you can't prove it (usually in the form of a paid invoice) you're in big trouble. Very big. (See "Incredibly painful mistake #1", above.)


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Incredibly painful
Mistake #3

Thinking to yourself, "Hey, I'll just use Photoshop? to remove all these pesky little copyright identifiers on this picture. Who's gonna know?"

Watermarking involves digitally embedding into an image a symbol that identifies the copyright holder.

The Digital Millennium Copyright Act of 1998 makes it a criminal offense to remove watermarks meant to protect copyright. Many people don't realize that under US copyright law, it is specifically illegal to remove a watermark from a photo. Not only is the act of removal prohibited, the courts assume that the very attempt indicates a willful intent to violate somebody's copyright. And that's something the courts come down really hard on. [See "Incredibly Painful Mistakes" numbers 1 & 2, above]


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Incredibly painful
Mistake #4
Thinking, hey, I'm too "small potatoes" for anyone to care.
To the contrary. The Internal Revenue Service figured this out a long time ago, which is why they focus on the "small" cheaters, not the big ones: There are a lot more "small fry" than there are "big cheeses", and the message you send when you attend to the smaller entities is a powerful "word of mouth" engine. If you're doing a little out-of-the-way website or a local-distribution brochure and thinking you'll just appropriate a few images because, after all, who's going to care... guess what? You are smack in the bull's-eye, exactly the "profile" that is being targeted.


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Why we hate talking about this stuff...
Simple: In over two decades of doing business with literally hundreds of thousands of designers around the world, we have found that our customers are overwhelmingly honest and straightforward with no desire whatsoever to be anything but scrupulously attentive to the dictates of "fair play". As creative people themselves, they understand the importance of "intellectual property" (their own as well as ours) and are utterly reliable-- and a flat-out pleasure to deal with.

In short, we hate talking about this stuff because it makes us sound like we don't trust our customers-- and nothing could be further from the truth.


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Why we talk about it anyway...
There are those who don't mind keeping beginners "in the dark"-- and then pouncing when they make a mistake. If we're going to tell you that you shouldn't even THINK about "stealing" a picture, we figure we ought to tell you what we mean-- and why-- and let you know that you could be getting yourself into much bigger trouble than you might imagine.



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What does "Intellectual Property" mean?
"Intellectual property" refers to original creations in the fields of literature and the arts. Most countries in the world provide automatic copyright protection to any item of intellectual property at the instant the item is created. At the instant a photo is taken, it automatically becomes the "intellectual property" of the photographer who took it. It makes no difference what the subject is or why the photograph was taken.



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What is "copyright infringement", anyway?
Legally, the person who holds the copyright to a photo has the absolute right to control how you use that photo -- or to deny you the right to use that photo at all. Any unauthorized usage is an "infringement" of the copyright. This INCLUDES using the picture for "reference" in a derivative work. It also includes use of images BEYOND that which has been legitimately purchased. For example, offering images for resale without first obtaining a template license would be an infringement of copyright. So, too, would be the case if you exceed the 10 User Limit without obtaining a site license.

Many people don't realize just how all-encompassing a copyright is. For example, there's a common misconception that any image appearing on a website may be downloaded and "saved" to disk. This is absolutely not the case. The very act of saving a copyrighted image to your local disk -- regardless of whether you ever do anything else with the image or not -- constitutes a copyright infringement -- minor, perhaps, and done all the time, but an infringement nonetheless. And infringements large and small are "actionable" (i.e., can be grounds for a lawsuit.)

On this website, once you are registered and have agreed to our terms and conditions, you ARE allowed to download "comping versions" to "try out" in your layout. But the terms state that you are specifically NOT allowed to use the images in any OTHER way, unless you secure the proper "copyright" permission to do so - by purchasing the image. And, by the act of downloading, you are agreeing to those terms. Terms for downloading comping images from this website.


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How to keep yourself out of trouble
All you really have to do is respect both the letter and the spirit of the copyright laws -- and use common sense. Obviously, you're taking a big risk if you download images willy-nilly without regard to who owns them and whether you have permission to do so. All stock agencies include Terms and Conditions for downloading images right on their website. Read them. Observe them. They tend to have a lot in common but they're not all identical. The devil, as they say, is in the details.

Agencies invariably permit you to download an image to use for creating comps and for "pitching" a client. But that doesn't mean you can use the image as an "end-product" in itself without paying a fee -- even if the use is internal to your company. Whether or not the image is watermarked, you may not use it in any other manner except as specifically permitted in the Terms & Conditions listed on the company's website -- unless you pay the required fee, of course.

One word of caution: You would be surprised at how often we get calls from people who want to use an image but can't do so because they don't know which agency they got it from. As a bare minimum, you should set up agency-specific folders in your computer into which you download images. That way, you've at least got a chance of determining later on who to contact when you're ready to "go" with the image. You don't want to be in a position where you've got an approved project but you can't figure out who to obtain the rights from in order to be able to use an image that is integral to the design.


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Why are penalties for copyright infringement so severe?
Copyright laws exist to encourage people to be creative by giving them the right to control -- and benefit from -- the products of that creativity. Because it's so easy these days for one person to "steal" the creative output of somebody else, lawmakers have recognized that for copyright laws to be effective, they must have real teeth.

If copyright infringement resulted in nothing but a slap on the wrist, there are unfortunately those who would say to themselves, "If I get caught, I'll just pay the fine and consider it a cost of doing business." Lawmakers in the US have figured that $150,000.00 -- the maximim fine that can be awarded per infringement -- is a figure large enough to discourage that attitude in most people.

So, if you have larceny in your heart, think twice...!
One hundred and fifty thousand dollars! (That's once.)
One-hundred-and-fifty thousand dollars!



MAX

genis
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: Dallas, TX
Insane since: Aug 2002

posted posted 10-31-2002 09:58

hey Max... did you ask permission to reprint that original work of literature on these forums?



mahjqa
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: The Demented Side of the Fence
Insane since: Aug 2000

posted posted 10-31-2002 13:25

And people keep on wondering why I insist on not using stock photography.

Petskull
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: 127 Halcyon Road, Marenia, Atlantis
Insane since: Aug 2000

posted posted 10-31-2002 13:39
quote:
The very act of saving a copyrighted image to your local disk -- regardless of whether you ever do anything else with the image or not -- constitutes a copyright infringement



Alright! All you criminals who've downloaded any images from this site into your cache, hands against the wall and SPREAD 'EM!!

heh... so, in theory, you can't even visit any sites with anything other than a text browser unless you're given explicit permission?


Code - CGI - links - DHTML - Javascript - Perl - programming - Magic - http://www.twistedport.com
ICQ: 67751342

[This message has been edited by Petskull (edited 10-31-2002).]

Ducati
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: in your head
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted posted 10-31-2002 14:09

Good point Petskull

MAX

Slime
Lunatic (VI) Mad Scientist

From: Massachusetts, USA
Insane since: Mar 2000

posted posted 10-31-2002 17:39

Yeah, I was wondering that too. Then again, I didn't explicitly cause those images to be downloaded. Microsoft's software did it without my consent.

On the other hand, by viewing a web page, I gave the software consent to download that page. Hmm. I wonder if this has been thought of and put into the laws?

mas
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: the space between us
Insane since: Sep 2002

posted posted 10-31-2002 17:43

damn somebody should have sent this to the guyz of the psygnosis rip...remember?

-THE SPACE-

DL-44
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: under the bed
Insane since: Feb 2000

posted posted 10-31-2002 19:12

Interestingly enough, I seem to recall a whole bunch of people trying to explain many of these things to you, Ducati, when you had your thread regarding whether or not to use the copyrighted images of the Compaq servers on your business website.

I also seem to recall you telling us all that it was a crock of shit and you were going to use them anyway.

Thanks for the "new" info though.

=)



Ducati
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: in your head
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted posted 10-31-2002 21:32

uuhmm ok then....so that doesn't entitle me to post this????

edit:

I posted this for FYI. Take it how you like it.

MAX

[This message has been edited by Ducati (edited 10-31-2002).]

DL-44
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: under the bed
Insane since: Feb 2000

posted posted 11-01-2002 15:58

~re-reading post~

nope. never mentioned anything about entitlement to post.

just pointing out the irony.

We gave *you* the info way back when as an 'fyi' if you recall....

=)



Petskull
Maniac (V) Mad Scientist

From: 127 Halcyon Road, Marenia, Atlantis
Insane since: Aug 2000

posted posted 11-01-2002 16:49

oh, both of you, shut the hell up...


Code - CGI - links - DHTML - Javascript - Perl - programming - Magic - http://www.twistedport.com
ICQ: 67751342

Ducati
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: in your head
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted posted 11-01-2002 18:04

DL-44, it happened almost a year ago. Get over it. And as I recall I asked if it was ok to use computer images from companies like Dell or Compaq. Many said no, many said yes.

What would be your point anyway???? I thought it would be interesting read for everyone. No? Well.. don't read it then.

Now, be a nice boy and go back to your room..

MAX

DL-44
Maniac (V) Inmate

From: under the bed
Insane since: Feb 2000

posted posted 11-01-2002 18:25

As I said 'just pointing out the irony'

I like irony.

=)

ettie
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: Arlington, Virginia, USA
Insane since: Oct 2002

posted posted 11-01-2002 18:27

oooh...Alright...a pissing contest!! Oh how entertaining ...

abb
Bipolar (III) Inmate

From: Victoria, BC
Insane since: Mar 2002

posted posted 11-01-2002 18:31

In my class (yes im still in school) I was taught that as soon as you make somthing, it is copyrighted (in Canada & US), but, if you expect legal troubles, you have to register (pay for) your copyright for it to stand up in court--how can you prove that you made it.
And an infringement only happens if you sell, rent, distribute, show in public, or import into Canada to sell, rent, distribute... see here
Canadian Copyright Act


ABB

Ducati
Paranoid (IV) Inmate

From: in your head
Insane since: Feb 2001

posted posted 11-01-2002 18:41

Well then.. thank you for pointing it out....




MAX

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