Topic: "Job" shop nonsense (Page 1 of 1)

I got tired of reading all the other crap on this site and decided to post my own crap.

I'm fed up with so-called job shops.
I think they should be forced to call themselves what they are: applicant screening shops.

Here in Southern Oregon, unemployment has gone ballistic.
In the largest city (Medford) there are 19 jobs listed and some of those are for work-at-home schemes.
This is because the employers are prevented from talking to applicants, qualified or not. Screeners are controlling the market.

These screening agencies have taken all the interactive element completely out of a job search.
They do it by denying anyone who isn't 100.0000000% qualified (in their opinion) access to an employer about an opportunity.

In my case, I have applied for over 50 positions in two years through screeners and have never gotten a call for an interview. Not one. I make sure my qualifications match the stated requirements for the job but never hear anything. I send updated resumes when needed and supply way more information than most people would, because I believe more information is good and will help define my skills better.

I have to do the best I can working low paying jobs that I can get on my own. I'm denied opportunities because some jerk middle-man doesn't think I'll "fit".

The truth is, I've NEVER had a job I had done before. I've always sold myself and performed beyond the expectations of the employer. However, for the last two years I've not been able to even talk to a higher paying employer because of this crap with job shops.

I've written my senator and representative with no reply. I've begged screeners to get me an interview and let me do the work of selling myself to no avail.

Base wages are also dropping in this area as these shops control them.

Is anyone else running into this process? What do you think about a society depersonalizing the process of finding suitable employment? Is it a sign of a degrading society because the process is dehumanized? Is it best? Should we try to regulate an industry that serves only employers? Is it socialism? Well?

~allewyn

(Edited by Allewyn on 02-11-2009 21:05)

Wow.

Are things really like that now in the States?

That kind of takes all the ability to manipulate people with soft skills right out of the equation.

So I guess falsifying one's credentials is increasing in leaps and bounds, then?

Bummer, man, I feel for you.

BTW - I used to live in Eastern Oregon - Baker City. Before that, we lived on the border to Southern Oregon, not all to far from where you are now.

Trippy.

WebShaman | The keenest sorrow (and greatest truth) is to recognize ourselves as the sole cause of all our adversities.
- Sophocles

(Edited by WebShaman on 02-11-2009 21:40)

job shops?

Get me past the hurdle of "What the hell is a job shop?" and I'll have more to offer your comment.

-S

Looks like you're forced to take the hard way, gather up a few buddies and make your own business ... if things were just that easy ... I feel for you too ... I'm clinging to the job I have even tho it doesn't even pay anything near what you guys are getting for these "low-paying" jobs in the states. Had I been put through some agency or 'job shop' I wouldn't even have that.

My bets are on you guys not getting rid of those job shops tho simple because they clearly benefit the employers financially. So you have to find another way.

I haven't really thought this through but what about the following strategy:

1) Find people who work for the companies that you're interested in. Maybe you know some already.
2) Befriend them and convince them of your capabilities.
3) Let them recommend you to their respective HR people/middle management. If you're lucky their HR may already be looking for recommendations from the inside...
4) Profit?

Maybe this way you can at least get some face time and don't have to go through a job shop ...

Requesting third party comments on this please

Webshaman - ?? Um, No... Allewyn said things are like that in Southern Oregon.

The social networking idea is sound... In this current economic environment it might not be that functional though. Enough people are just trying to keep their jobs and may be less willing to add another salary to a firm they work for. Especially if you are being recommended for a value add job and they currently work in an overhead position.

I'd personally go that route anyway though.. It doesn't sound like you'll be getting much help from the 'job shop'. These sound significantly different than the contract houses we have around the midwest. There the employees get distributed to the areas of work that they have skill sets for and get paid via contract from the employer. Typically once the contract term is over the employer can hire the contractor as a 'regular' employee. Contractor wages tend to be less due to the agencies cut. I haven't heard of things being so bad here.

Either do that or just start walking into places that match your current interests or skill sets. Anything to get exposure to the employers... there is nothing the job shops can do to stop you from mailing in resumés or showing up at businesses to drop them off in person. Choose to NOT use the job shop and go it on your own... your ROI to date has been non-existent... even dismal results would be an improvement.

If the system takes advantage of you or doesn't serve you as it should... Don't use the system. Make the change, don't wait for someone to change it for you.

Sounds like a bad rap... I hope things get better for you.

GD

(Edited by GrythusDraconis on 02-12-2009 19:58)

quote:

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twItch^ said:

Get me past the hurdle of "What the hell is a job shop?" and I'll have more to offer your comment.

---

Employment Agencies I am guessing.

The agencies are not doing that well where I am but then again, very few places are hiring at all. Most of what the agencies do here are temp to hire or just plain temp work. Sales jobs seem plentiful but then again, not many places are buying anything.

Fortunately I have a job and have had it for a while now. I didn't get a raise last year but I also didn't loose my job which a lot of people have.

Later,

C:\

Webshaman - I would imagine people are beginning to lie to get jobs. It's pretty slow here...and I know where Baker is too

twItch^ - Yep job shops are employment agencies. Those places where you get an interview to review skills and they supposedly match you with an employer. That last part is what is lacking.

arturio - Thanks for the input. I'm not real sociable (couldn't tell right?) so I've not "rubbed shoulders" with those who could do me some good. But I guess I'll have to learn.

GrythusDraconis - I'm doing what I can to get help from the state but I wondered if anyone else was active. I don't believe these agencies should be allowed to block our knowing where jobs are available. That's the way it is here. They also are keep wages down as a result of controlling the market. It's a shame good people are going hungry here because employers are prevented (by contract) from making the positions known in other ways, such as the papers.

The only real alternatives are EDD listings (and I'm not a sheepherder) or craigslist which has very little now..

Do any of you think this trend has anything to do with the socialist direction America is going?
Do you think this kind of business should be regulated?

(Edited by Allewyn on 02-13-2009 01:51)

Well i am verry sorry to say so but what about the old style "initial application"(sorry that is what it is called here in austria.) You know YOU write the companies without them saying that they are looking for someone. Here in Austria it is almost the only way of getting a "proper" Job.

quote:

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Do any of you think this trend has anything to do with the socialist direction America is going?

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No socialism is the other way: the state stops "kapitalist economist monopolist" Job Shops of doing such things ^^

quote:

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Do you think this kind of business should be regulated?

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In your case i would defenetly say YES


p.S.: My opinion is only based on friends in job searching/finding situations and my education at an economy college. I have not yet had to find a job as a way of making a living.

quote:

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Allewyn said:

I don't believe these agencies should be allowed to block our knowing where jobs are available. That's the way it is here.

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Wow wow ... this sounds really bad ... how can this be acceptable at all? Nothing to do with socialism tho. I couldn't imagine not knowing to which company my cv is going to ... job description is one thing but there's also company reputation, location of the office etc these should be important factors in choosing where someone wants to work...

Job ad could say: IT Administration, benefits include: gym, inhouse library, sea view from office etc but when you go there and it turns out to be a prison island is that what you were really expecting?

quote:

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Arthurio said:

I couldn't imagine not knowing to which company my cv is going to ...

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Blind ads are very common here. There are a few reasons for this. One being that the actual hiring company does not want to be bothered with the phone calls wonder if "I got the job" or not. The other being that someone is getting fired and they are looking for their replacement

Later,

C:\

I've been seeing this trend in the US since the mid '80s. It's been getting worse as time goes on.

It started around the time the Congress passed the 1986 tax reform bill and the head-hunters were able to convince most companies that it was dangerous to hire a consultant without a head-hunting firm in between. That law is still on the books and can come back to bite the company in the ass, but the law is not being strictly enforced. Prior to the mid '80s most head-hunters were happy to place a contractor in a position and take 15-20% of the gross as their cut (admittedly a pretty high rate). By the early to mid '90s they felt they were being ripped-off if they didn't get at least 40-45% of the gross.

I used to search for jobs on Monster, Dice, etc. I stopped looking there five to seven years ago because there are no real jobs listed. 99% of all listings on Monster are from head-hunters trolling for fresh meat. They put up a listing with a lot of keywords in it trying to get a consultant to bite so they can tell you they don't have any definite positions right now, but if you'll give them a copy of your resume, they'll let you know if they find a match.

The head-hunters are controlling the job market through their use of marketing strategies to companies, using fear to convince the companies that a consultant can hurt them and the head-hunter will protect them from any danger.

It used to be that a head-hunter performed two services. 1) Many jobs are only listed through an agency. Even if you contact a company directly they will not admit they have any openings because they would rather have the head-hunter vetting the applicants. 2) Most companies want to pay net 30, 60, or 90. This means that if you work directly for them you will work for 60, 120, or 180 days before you see your first paycheck. Most consultants can't afford to work that long before getting paid. The head-hunter has a number of consultants working at several companies and already has income from these other companies so they can start paying you every week or every other week from the time you start working while they wait for the money to start arriving for your contract.

However, it's gotten so that many recruiting firms will not pay the consultant until the company pays them. This means that the consultant is the one suffering from the length of time it takes to get paid and is also the one taking the risk of doing all the work assuming the company will pay for the work.

Allewyn, I can understand your frustration over this and, unfortunately, I don't have any real suggestions to help you get through the head-hunter's screen to the real jobs. I have found that, because, I have experience with perl, I can look on the InterNET for companies that are listing jobs, rather than head-hunter listings and can circumvent the head-hunters in that way. It's harder to do with C, and C++.

The other thing to keep in mind is that in a good economy, it takes about 250 resume submissions to land a job. In this economy, I have no idea how many it will take, but 5000 or more would not surprise me. It's a numbers game and you just have to be persistent.

Good luck with your job search. Let us know if there's anything we can do to help you out.

.



-- not necessarily stoned... just beautiful.